E—No. 8

Having now said these things, I will talk to you with reference to the points of difference between you and the Government, and tell you my news. The first point is the property stolen from the Europeans. You will remember that this has been demanded to be given up, if you do not wish to be attacked. In my position as Governor, I do not care whether this is given back or not; but I will tell you what I think. You know, if in a tribe one steals from another, that the whole tribe rises and punishes the thief. Now I say that the Maories and the Europeans are one tribe ; and to say that I will attack the tribe that has the plunder, is to say that it is of a different tribe to ourselves, which I will not admit; and, therefore, whenever a man is caught with any of the stolen property, he will, even it be 20 years hence, be taken before the Judge, and if found to be a thief, he will be punished. I do not pretend to say if he is a thief or not; the Judge will do that when he is caught. Now I have told you this as Governor, I will speak to you as a friend on this point. I look upon the Maories as one " hapu" of the great family that inhabits this island. When a hapu looks upon a thief as a disgrace, it says to him, "give up the plunder, and don't bring disgrace upon us." Therefore I recommend you all to try and persuade the people who have the plunder to give it up. All nations are watching you, and I am jealous for you, and cannot bear to be the Governor of the Maori, and for other nations to say, " they (the Maories) are a nation of thieves." Just in the same way the father of two children, when he sees one of them take things from the other, tries to make him make restitution. So when I see Tarauaki has been plundered, I know the Europeans can never feel reconciled to the Maories unless some restitution is made ; and I would persuade them to make it. The next thing is about the Eoads. You seem to think that roads through the country would do no good. I think they would improve the value of the lands through which they pass ; and if you think I want to spend money in making roads through the land of people who don't want thereby enriching them at the expense of others, you must think me a fool. In the country of the Europeans, they have to pay the greater part of the cost of the roads before the Government helps them. In the same way I should be very unwilling to make roads through Native land, even if the owners came and asked me to do so, unless they paid part of the money. The only case in which I would pay for them would be, when the roads led to some very distant place which would benefit other districts, besides benefiting the lands of the Natives through which they pass. I will give you an instance of what I mean. I hear Waata Kukutai is going to cultivate on the top of the mountain (pointing to the hill behind the village). If he does not make a cart-road up to the cultivation, I shall think him a very cruel man, for otherwise he will kill or injure all the women who will have to bring down the loads of produce ; and the children that will be borne by them will be decrepit, and thus the tribe will be lost. But do you think I shall be such a fool as to come with troops and war to make the road ? No ! I tell him what will be the result, if he does not make the road, and T leave it to him. I should like to see all the laud covered with carts and horses and cattle, and all the people well dressed and flourishing ; but I shall not come and cut their throats if they don't like to be so. How should I like to be judged, with a row of dead bodies laid out before me, and one should say " how is this ? who slew them?" and I should have to say "I did, because they were foolish and did not know what was good for themselves !"—Look there (pointing to a heavily laden bullock dray passing) would you rather see your women laden with those things ? Those men who like their women to be killed with hard work and who do not like oxen and sheep, why, it is their own look out. Another thing —you must not think that I shall let travellers, either Europeans or Maories, be stopped and plundered; it is a very serious offeuce. I shall not make war upon the tribe; but if ever I catch the individual, he shall be punished. Now the third thing—the King—I will talk about. You heard Waata Kukutai say, I assented to the king and the flag. I must explain what I mean. If a tribe, or two or three, or more, call their Chief a king and stick up a flag, I think it nonsense, and don't mind it. I think it a foolish thing to do, and that it may lead to bad consequences; but I shall not quarrel with them until the bad consequences come. You must recollect that this king affair is mixed up with manv things that ought not to be. For instance, I hear that at the Runangas many of those people who have plundered the Europeans are present, and I think you should not associate with such wicked people. If I was in the king's place I would not associate with bad people. I even understand that people who have been receiving pay as Assessors i'rom Government, have besu associating with these people: and I think it wrong that people who are paid for patting down robbers should mix with them. In the same way I hear that the king has been making rules to prevent travellers going about: thisis wrong, and if ho does wrong things and he is caught, he will be tried like another man and punished. I can't help it—you must not misunderstaud me: —any man may stop people from coming on to his land, but where an accustomed line of road runs from one place to another, no man may block it up. You must be careful not to think that in this matter I shall quarrel with you all. I, as Governor, have nothing to do with it—the cause must be tried by the Judge, or by your Runangas when you have them, between the traveller and the owner of the soil. I speak to you as a friend, and as the namo of king has been mixed with many troubles and is much disliked by miriy people, I would get rid of it, and find some other namo: and then with the other Chiefs of the district I will work to establish law and order in the country. If they don't care to have me as a friend to help them and work with them, they must do without me. 1 can't help it. I will now speak to you on one. other point—the land.

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SPEECHES AT THE MEETINGS HELD BY