41

I.—2a

1187. But did you do so ? —I believe that every Native knew how his account stood. When they came into the store they generally looked over the ledger. 1188. Did you give them a note of what they got each time ?—Not as a rule. Sometimes they got invoices of what they took. 1189. Mr. Ormond.] Mr. Coleman, I understood from your evidence, was thoroughly acquainted with th_3 transaction? —Yes, he was thoroughly acquainted with this transaction. I informed Mr. Fountain of it within half an hour—certainly within an hour —of the time it was done. Mr. AVorgan, Mr. Morrison, Mr. Fountain, and myself spent the evening at Mr. Coleman's house. AYe showed the deed which was executed, and told Mr. Fountain of the document left with Paora. 1190. You at that time were purchasing as agent for Messrs. Coleman and Fountain ?—Yes, there is a document to that effect in the Eegistry Office. 1191. Did Mr. Fountain or Mr. Coleman in any way express dissatisfaction at the arrangement about the reserve?— Only to the effect that 1 had exceeded what had been arranged between us about the size of the reserve. Questions as to the extent of the reserve had cropped up at previous interviews. Paora had throughout insisted on the reserve. The question was whether it was to be 300 or 350 acres. There was a little dissatisfaction so far as concerned the extent of the reserve. 1192. Did Coleman and Fountain know of the transaction soon after ?—They knew of it immediately. 1193. In finally closing with Fountain and Coleman what did you hand over? All your interests, or what ?—All my interests as they were. 1194. The purchase not being complete ? —The purchase not being complete. 1195. Do you know anything of the transaction iv which Messrs. AVatt and Farmer paid a further sum ? I should ask, first, are you aware of the sale by Mr. Coleman to Messrs Watt and Farmer ?— Yes. 1196. Do you know anything of that transaction ? —Yes; I remember the resale from the Natives to Watt. 1197. Do you know if this transaction was referred to when that arrangement was completed ?— James Watt told me that it was. 1198. There was a question about the books. When the Hawke's Bay Land Alienation Commission sat in Hawke's Bay were they the same as other persons who were in business submitted to the Judge of the Court for examination ?—They were. 1199. Who was the examiner ?—Mr. Witty. 1200. Was he an accountant ?—Yes. 1201. Selected by the Court ?—Yes. 1202. What were his duties in regard to the accounts ? —To examine carefully into them, and report regarding the nature of the supplies ; to make a synopsis showing the portion of the accounts for goods; and, in certain cases, to show what money was paid to the Natives. 1203. Did he make a report of that character to the Commission?—He did. 1204. AVhat was that report ? Was it favourable or unfavourable to the dealers ?—lt was described by the Commissioner as favourable. 1205. Mr. Rees.] You say that previous to going to Paora's pa you knew that the reserve was wanted. Did you ever see Paora about it before that night ?—I do not know whether it was Paora or Eora 1 saw about it. It was known to myself that Paora would uot consent to sell unless the reserve was granted. 1206. Had you ever seen Eora before about it ?—Yes. 1207. Where ?—ln my shop. 1208. Did you see her about the purchase ?—Not specially. The purchase was referred to as a matter of conversation. 1209. Did you negotiate with Eora ?—We had some conversation as to whether her father would sell. 1210. On more than one occasion ?—Yes; I should say on several occasions. 1211. Did you agree with Eora as to terms ?—No ; we talked about a reserve of 300 acres. 1212. Did you ever, previously to your going with Worgan, speak to Paora himself about the matter ?—I think so, on several occasions. Paora used to be often in my shop before that. 1213. Had you made any terms with Eora? —No terms at all were made previous to the interview. 1214. I think there was a man named Hastie in your employment at that time ?—A Tery likely.' 1215. lam not asking you to say " Aery likely." Was a man named Hastie in your employ at that time ?—Very likely. I had several men in my employ at that time. I cannot remember whether Hastie was with me at that time. I think he was. 1216. What time did you leave Napier ?—ln the afternoon, I believe, as near four o'clock as possible. 1217. Was Mr. Worgan with you when you left ?—Yes; and Mr. Morrison. AYe started from my residence in Napier. 1218. Driving?— Driving. 1219. In your own buggy ?—ln my own buggy with my own mare. 1220. Did you ever go on any other trip to Mr. Coleman's, or anywhere about there, with Worgan ?—I did. 1221. Do you remember when that was ?—I do not remember whether it was before or after this trip. My impression is that it was somewhere about the same time, within a few months. I think it was very likely it was shortly afterwards. 1222. AVhen you went into the whare at Paora's pa do you remember who you saw there ?— There were there the three Natives who have been examined as witnesses in this case. There was an old man—l do not know whether it was Eeihana or Werahika, the father of one of the girls who gave evidence. Eeihana at that time did not live at Paora's pa. 1223. The three witnesses who have given evidence were there, at any rate ?—Yes. 6—l. 2a.

Mr. Sutton,

25th Nov., 1879.