GK—2

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250. Hone Pihama : I have a question to ask Mr. Parris about the Whareroa Eeserve. Did not you and Mr. Eichmond say formerly that the original line for the Natives was to follow the stream ? 251. Mr. Parris: What line do you speak of? 252. Hone Pihama : The Tawhiti Stream. 253. Mr. Parris : It is quite possible, but I have no recollection of it. 254. Hone Pihama : That being so, I shall have nothing more to say on the matter. 255. The Commissioners : There is one thing to be remembered : the area of the Whareroa Eeserve was to be 10,000 acres; but the actual quantity amounts to 10,500 acres. You therefore get more (besides the 107 acres between the Tawhiti and Tangahoe Streams) than you thought you had when you began talking yesterday.

At Hawera, Friday, 27th February, 1880. Major Brown re-examined. 256. The Commissioners.] In the evidence which you gave yesterday, you said the change in the Stratford Beserve had been made by the instructions of the Government. It seems to us that it was only an approval by Major Atkinson of the change which was to be arranged between yourselves and the Superintendent. Is that not so ? —lt was the Superintendent and Mr. Kelly who moved the Government to have the reserve shifted, and Major Atkinson told me to have it removed. That was done verbally, and therefore I have nothing referring to the question except the telegram which I received afterwards. 257. The change was made somewhere about April, 1876 ?—Yes. 258. At that time had your attention been called to the gazetting of the original 700 acres ?—No; I was not aware that it had been gazetted. 259. Who generally attends to the Native reserves in the Taranaki Province: the Civil Commissioner, or the Commissioner of Crown Lands ?—The Civil Commissioner. Lucy Takiora Dalton examined. 260. The Commissioners.] Will you let the Commission know the facts of the promise which you say was made to you by Sir Donald McLean? —I will first hand in a letter from Wharerata to the Commissioners. [Letter translated as follows : " I wish you to hear this statement. It was in the year 1878 that I went to Wellington with my niece. We went to Mr. Sheehan and Major Brown about the surveyors going to Waimate, and we asked that only the seaward side of the road should be taken by the Government, and that the inland portion should he given to me and my niece and our tribe. After that I asked for the fishing-station, and Major Brown said that ourrequest would be considered; and this is why we sent this paper to you. We now write this that we may hear what the Commissioners will say ; and I also ask the Government to secure the burial ground near the sea coast."] 261. Will you tell the Commissioners what took place between yourself and Sir Donald McLean in 1872, when you say the promise was made? —In that year I went to Wanganui with Hone Pihama, and there saw Sir Donald McLean. I asked him for some land, and he said he would give me some. I asked for laud for myself and Mrs. Hone Pihama, who is my first cousin. Hone Pihama said to Sir Donald McLean, " What she says is true, because they are always after me for some land." He said that his wife was always pressing him to get a reserve, and I explained to Sir Donald McLean that she was my cousin, and that I should like her to bave some land as well as myself ; and that was settled down at Wanganui. Sir Donald McLean told me to see him again at Patea, wdien he returned from Wellington. 262. Where is the land you then claimed ? —lt was on tbis side of the river. When Sir Donald McLean returned to Patea from Wellington, accompanied by Wi Parata, Mr. Parris, and Hone Pihama, I went to Hone Pihama and asked him how he would like the laud to be treated ; and he said, "It will be better for you to divide it." Next day Mr. Parris, Hone Pihama, and Wi Parata went on to New Plymouth, and Sir Donald McLean sent for me to come down and see him. He then asked me where I wanted the land, and I said that I wished for some land over at Ketemarae. That was the land of my grandmother and my mother. He asked if I was not satisfied with what he gave me at Hukatere. He, however, agreed to my request, and told Captain Wray to lay out portions for myself and Hone Pihama's wife. "We then went into conversation about the Waimate Plains. I asked him for some reserves for my tribe, Kanihi, who were then living at Kaupukunui, and were without land, as were also the Ngatitupaea and all of them. He said to me, "A rour tribe will get some land." Then he told me to go straight on to Kaupukunui, and from there to New Plymouth, where the Court was to be held. He gave me a document, and he said, "You had better give up all claims you have on this side. You ought to be satisfied with what you are getting on this side of the Waingongoro." I said, " What about my claims on the other side?" And ho said, "If you give up your claims on this side you will get your claims secured to you on the other." Then he gave mea document showing how he wanted the Waimate Plains to be carried out, which he wished me to show to my tribe. I read the document, in which Sir Donald McLean promised that, if the Natives allowed the surveyors to cross the river in order to survey the Waimate Plains, he would let them have the land from the Waingongoro to the Inaha Bivers, from the sea to the mountain, as the boundary between the Natives and the Government. When I came back I spoke to Manaia about it at my place, and Manaia could not give a decided answer, because Titokowaru and other members of the tribe were not there. An attempt was made by the surveyors at the time to cross the river. That was during Mr. Parris's time. They started, and they camped at Kauae ; and the same people who consented to get the surveyors across the river made the disturbance. Pepe was mixed up with it. When I took Sir Donald McLean the document from Pepe and Wharerata, he handed it over to Hone Pihama, who read it and cautioned Sir Donald McLean to be careful with Heke, who was on the Government side once but had left us and turned against us. Hone Pihama's words did not go far, and the surveyors were turned back from the other side of the river. 263. Hone Pihama : What Mrs. Dalton has said about the piece of land is quite correct. I said that