I.—2a

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1178. What is the character of Adam Clark ? —"Well, I have found him a very hard man to deal with in money matters. 1179. What do you mean by that ? —By that I mean he would hardly let you know that he had any money if he had a large sum. 1180. Did you find him honest in his dealings ?—Well, on the whole I found him honest. 1181. But what was the general character that he bore with you? Did you know him very well ?— I knew him very well. 1182. Well, you formed in the course of your acquaintance some idea of his character: what was that idea ? —My opinion of Adam Clark is that he is not strictly honest. 1183. Have you any instances of dishonesty?—Tes. 1184. Would you tell the Committee what you mean? —When I left Auckland some four years ago to reside in the Waikato, he owed me somewhere about £10, and I met him in Auckland some six months ago and asked him to pay his account. He said," Tes, I know that I owe you the money, but I have not the means to pay you just now. I cannot pay you." I have heard for a fact since that he has got a lot of money in the bank, and receives money frequently. 1185. You found your idea of his dishonesty upon that ? —Tes. 1186. Anything else ?—I heard some years ago that he would receive money, and after a time deny having received it. 1187. I am speaking now not of what you heard from others. I want to get at your own knowledge of him ?—That is the only instance where I have proved him to be dishonest—in his denying that he had money to pay me, when I have heard for a fact that he had plenty of funds. 1188. Mr. SheehanJ] Tou speak Maori ? —Tes. 1189. When you were in business in Auckland you were mostly engaged in the Native trade ?— My trade in Auckland was principally Native trade. 1190. I think I should not be wrong in describing your store as a sort of exchange or club-room for the Natives ?—Tes, it was so. 1191. Tou have told the Committee that you remember the occasion of the purchase of the Pakiri Block?—Tes. 1192. And the payment of money to Adam Clark?—Tes. 1193. Tou have also told the Committee that Adam Clark purchased goods from you ?—Tes. 1194. At that time ?—Tes. 1195. In addition to purchasing goods, did he pay you any account?— That sum that he paid me would be an account that he owed, and would include the goods that he purchased at the time. That covered the account and the purchases then made. 1190. Tou say that he paid you in notes p-^-He paid me in notes. 1197. Did you observe that he had money upon him at the time ?—He had a lot of money. 1198. What was it composed of —notes, or notes and gold ? —lt was notes and gold. 1199. How was he carrying it? —He had a pocket-book with a lot of either ten- or twenty-pound notes, and he had a purse with small notes, and gold also. 1200. Tou did not hear from him what amount he had received ? —I did not hear from himself. 1201. If Adam Clark states that he did not buy things at your shop at the time, or pay you an account, is that statement correct ? —'No, it is not. 1202. Sir William Fox."] The only question I want to ask you is as to the precise date. Can you fix the precise date? —No, I cannot. 1203. Can you fix the date of the Pakiri purchase ? —No, I cannot; but I know it was the time they received the money for the Pakiri Block. 1204. Adam Clark was often in Auckland, was he not ?—Tes : sometimes once in three months, at others once in six; generally once in six months. 1205. When he came in he had transactions with you, I presume ?—Generally. 1206. Tou are sure there was gold among his money ?—I am certain there was gold. 1207. The Chairman^] May I ask you again if you can fix a little more closely the amount of money he paid ? —I cannot say exactly to a few pounds; I know it was over £20 and under £30. 1208. Could you tell the Committee about how much of this was for old account, and how much for new ? —There was very little of it old account; it was mostly new account that he paid when he was in Auckland at that time. Te Hemaka Tatjhia sworn and examined. 1209. Mr. Sheehan.'] Do you know Adam Clark ? —Tes. 1210. Do you know the block of land called the Pakiri Block ?—Tes. 1211. Do you remember having been concerned in relation to the sale of that block to the Government ? —Tes. 1212. Did you see Adam Clark about that matter ? —Tes. 1213. Where did you first see him ? —Can I tell the Committee when I first met Arama Karaka at the Court ? 1214. There can be no objection, I presume?—l was present at the investigation by the Court, and saw Arama Karaka. After this the land was arranged to be sold. I received a communication from Mr. Nelson asking me to appear as a witness in the transaction. When I arrived at Makarau Arama Karaka was there, and those interested in the land. Next day I went by boat with Arama Karaka to the Awaroa (Helensville) ; only Arama Karaka and myself arrived there at that time. Hori te More remained behind to attend to his child, who was ill. Nelson asked me where Hori was. I told him that he had remained behind to look after his child. He then said that he would go and fetch Hori. He got into a boat and went to Makarau. He brought Hori to Awaroa. We assembled together in a hotel at Helensville, and talked about the disposal of the land. Those who were present were Hori te More, Arama Karaka, Mr. Nelson, and myself. I asked both Arama Karaka and Hori te More, "Do you wish to sell this land, Pakiri ? " and they said " Tes." I then said to them, " Well,

Mr. W. Oliver. Aug. 19, 1880.

Te Semara TanMa. Aug. 19, 1880.