I.—2a,

52

Mr. J. Sheehan, M.H.M. Not. 8,1877.

in the grant, for whom myself and Arama Karaka were trustees ; and that to enable us to sell it would be necessary to have statutory power from the Assembly. And I also told him that by the death of Panapa, the other grantee, there was a vacancy in the Crown grant, and until Hori's claim was heard and decided we could not give a title for that land. Sir Donald McLean informed me that the Government had the matter under their consideration, and intended to ask the House to legislate on the subject, so as to give a general power, where dealing with the property of minors on behalf of the Government, to dispose of it under the Maori Heal Estate Management Act of 1867. This purchasing from minors on behalf of the Government, is a matter of every-day occurrence. Nothing further took place at that time until we met here in Wellington in 1872. It will be remembered there was a want-of-confidence motion during the session. Sir Donald McLean sent for me and told me McLeod was still pressing, and asked me if I could see my way to some settlement. The want-of-confldence motion came in between, and we could not well discuss a question of that kind while that motion was pending ; but after the Stafford Government were rejected from office on Sir Julius Vogel's motion, the matter again came up, I think about a week afterwards, and Sir Donald McLean told me he had determined to make McLeod a temporary advance as against the purchase, and I fancy you will find in the papers a voucher for the amount paid to McLeod. That amount was paid to McLeod before any negotiation had taken place between myself and the Natives, and with full and complete knowledge of the title. Sir Donald McLean paid, I think, £100 on account. Afterwards, in the final settlement, Mr. Brissenden deducted it. Nothing further took place with regard to the block beyond payment of this sum to McLeod in 1872 until 1873. On the 21st February, 1873, I was present at Kaipara. The Land Court was being held there for various purposes, and amongst others there was an application in from Hori Te More to be appointed successor to his son, Panapa. I was waited upon by Colonel McDonnell, then Native Land-Purchase Commissioner, and he told me that Hori Te More's application was coming on at Kaipara, and he expected Hori and Karaka and all concerned would be present; that he had instructions from the Government to have the agreement signed, and he would be glad if I would go up and assist. I went up to Kaipara with Colonel McDonnell, and this agreement was drawn up and signed by Hori, Arama Karaka, and myself. The sum of £10 each was paid on account by Colonel McDonnell to Hori and Adam Clark. As trustee, and as one of the parties to the transaction, I appeared, and the money was passed to them in my presence. In confirmation of what I have said, the Committee will see that one of the stipulations I have put into the agreement is that the parties of the first part, Adam Clark and John Sheehan, shall be authorised by law to dispose of the freehold of the Pakiri Block. I, of course, knew exactly what my legal position was as trustee. I knew I could not sell, but, having the assurance of Sir Donald McLean that the law would be altered, I put in that provision to protect myself, so that until the law was altered the bargain would not be binding on myself or co-trustee, Adam Clark. I then went to Napier to attend the sittings of the Hawke's Bay Commission, and practically was away from Auckland, until after the Assembly. I returned to Auckland for about a fortnight between the sitting of the Commission and the meeting of the Assembly. Nothing transpired with regard to this Pakiri Block during the time I was in Auckland, and it did not come before me again in any shape whatever until towards the end of the year. But, before leaving this agreement to Colonel McDonnell, I should say he had precise instructions confirming what I state— namely, he was aware of the position of the block, that without the authority of law we could not sell; and, further, he knew that Hori's title was only an application to succeed Panapa, and I understand the Court adjourned the claim or dismissed it on some technical ground; so that the Committee will observe that the assumption of the Auditor-General that in 1874 I concealed these important facts in relation to title, when I brought them to Sir Donald McLean's notice iv 1872, and Colonel McDonnell's in 1873, is entirely without foundation. Nothing further took place until some time about the end of the year. On my return to Auckland, towards the endof the year (I went back for the purpose of attending the sittings of the Provincial Council; I had sot then ceased to be a member of the Provincial Executive, but was engaged carrying on the business of the Council), the Natives came to town along with Mr. Swanson. They came to town to complete an arrangement made between themselves and Mr. Stannus Jones. Nothing had been done by the G-overnment between the paying of the £10 each and this time,' and the Natives came to the conclusion that the matter w ras abandoned. They had agreed to let the timber to a Mr. Morton Jones. I was asked to agree to that. The Natives told me they had agreed with Jones and Gibbons to allow them to cut timber for £300. I said, " What about the transaction you had with the G-overnment ? " They said, " The Government have done nothing but pay us £10 nine or ten months ago, and we have heard nothing further about it." I heard nothing from the first agreement and Jones's timber agreement. They further said they did not care whether I concurred in the arrangement or not; that they were going to lease to Jones, and would get the money. That being the case, I saw Jones, and he said, " Well, if you like to carry out this transaction, you can do it in your office as a matter of business, and you can charge the ordinary and proper fees for doing so." I mention this to show my position at the time. I had transferred all my interest in the business as soon as I joined the Executive to Dignan and Armstrong, and was not concerned to the extent of one penny in their business or receipts. I required from Jones two stipulations, which I put in upon the assumption that the Government might at the last moment come forward to complete the purchase. I put in a covenant that he would not attempt to acquire the freehold ; the second stipulation was that if at any time the Government completed the transaction, he would receive what he had paid, together with any reasonable compensation to which he might be considered entitled. Not very long afterwards, I should say two or three months, in May, 1874, the Provincial Council adjourned, and time was given to Mr. "Williamson, who had succeeded Mr. Gillies, to look into affairs and prepare his measures. I had returned to Auckland, and was in the position of a member of the Executive, when the Maoris came to town with the intention of concluding the agreement with the Grovernment. They were accompanied by Mr. Brissenden and Mr. Nelson, the interpreter. He was the interpreter when the land was put through the Court, and knew (he title as well as I did. I observe the Auditor-Greneral draws conspicuous attention to the fact that