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they came to the police branch, did you say, "John Smith, you go over to the Police Force," and then, was his appointment as policeman dated from that date ?—There were a certain number of applicants or candidates on the list for employment in the police. There were Police Guides or books placed in the library for them to work themselves up and get a rough idea of civil duties. When I got an order from the Commissioner's Office —Colonel Eeader was then Commissioner— the order was worded, " Send a foot-man to Hokitika." I took the oldest member on the list of candidates, unless he originally came from that district, and there was an unwritten law that we should not send a man back to his own district. 34. When did his appointment as policeman date from ?—I paid him up to and for the date he left the depot; and I presume he came on police pay—l could not say—the next day. 35. Would that in your opinion be the proper way to treat him—to date it from that date ?—I think so, because while the man is travelling to his new station he should receive pay. 36. But would it be fair, in your opinion, to date his appointment from the original date of his joining the A.C. Force ?—I think not. I think from the date of his joining the civil branch. 37. It was generally known for some time before it was abolished that the A.C. Force was a sinking ship ? —Yes. 38. Consequently a great many men, seeing that, got or applied to be transferred to the civil police?—l believe so. I believe that was the reason. That is my candid opinion. 39. Then, those who remained on had rather a good time of it in those days—did they not get extra pay for making roads ?—At out-stations I believe they did. 40. I mean on the West Coast ? —Yes, I believe they did. I know this : that men were most anxious to get away from Wellington to join the service companies, as they were called. 41. Then, these men were encamped on the West Coast and were living very cheaply ?—Yes. 42. And had extra pay for road-making while their comrades were doing street duty ?—Yes; and if they had been twenty years in the A.C. Force, from their knowledge they were really recruits the day they joined the police. They had no civil police experience, and they were not as valuable to the head of the civil police as the man who had been two years a civil policeman. 43. What I want to know is this : If those men who have been making roads and living at a cheap mess were brought into the Police Force on the original dates of their A.C. appointment, would it be a proper thing to do ? —No ; it would be unfair to the men who had been serving years in the civil police. 44. Mr. Poynton.] What care is exercised in relation to the character of recruits for the Permanent Artillery at the present time ?—You are asking me a question I cannot reply to. 45. The Chairman.] Recruiting from the Permanent Artillery to the police does go on at the present time ?—Yes ; we were ordered to discharge a man yesterday, I think, on his transfer to the civil police—a man named Martin. Mr. Poynton.] Do you know anything about the care that is exercised in examining the antecedents of the men whom you enrol ?—The method is this, at present: A man presents himself at the depot, and hands in a letter, "Please enrol So-and-so in the Permanent Artillery." 47. You have no knowledge of any procedure before that ?—No. We have no knowledge whatever of his character. 48. Mr. Tunbridge.] The Permanent Artillery, I believe, when they are out of barracks on leave or pass, are at liberty to go just where they choose?— Quite so. 49. That means they may go to public-houses and drink, or they may go to brothels?— Quite so. 50. Without committing any breach of the regulations of your Force ? —-Yes. It is no offence against the laws of the colony for any man to enter a brothel. When you say a brothel, I think if they were seen in a recognised brothel by one of our non-commissioned officers he would be to a certain extent neglecting his duty if he did not bring the case under the notice of the commanding officer; but, having done so, the commanding officer could not punish the men, because they had committed no military or civil offence. 51. You said the effect of having police constables who had passed through the Permanent Artillery would be of benefit to the colony, as they would have a fair idea of artillery work, and would, in case of a sudden disturbance with the outside world, be an advantage to a certain extent. Can you suggest in what way the vacancies caused in the Police Force at that time by withdrawing all these men would be filled ?—Swearing in district constables. 52. Men totally unacquainted with police work?— Well, I do not see what else you could do. Defending the colony would be of more importance than police work for the time being. 53. You, as a military man, have read up the history of wars in different countries. We go back to one of the greatest of European wars, the Franco-Prussian : Do you not find that lawless people, in Paris and other places, availed themselves of the opportunity afforded by the invasion of the German army to sack places, and so on ?—Oh, yes. 54. Would not the civil police be required at the time of a threatened outside invasion equally as much, or even more than in ordinary times ? —Yes. But I think defending the harbour from attack, if it ever was attacked, would be of more importance for the time being, because you could get your policemen back again. I have thought the matter over a good deal, and, from my point of view, I think it a great advantage to have the police go through a certain amount of military training, as, in case of a civil disturbance, their officers can use them as partially-trained men instead of as a mob. 55. Colonel Hume.] Was or was not some order issued not very long ago prohibiting Permanent Artillery-men from going into publichouses in uniform ?—I do not think so. 56. Would you know if it had been issued?—No ; it might have been issued when I was away, but I should say not. A man is independent so long as he conducts himself properly. There is no breach of discipline in going in and having a glass of ale, or any other form of refreshment.