I. -6a

26

86. Do you know if the guard Burroughs had ever had any experience ?—He had been out several times, whether on a train like that or not I am not prepared to say. 87. Did you hear him give evidence before the Boyal Commission ?—Yes. 88. Do you remember what he said before the Boyal Commission as to the extent of his experience in attending trains ?—He says here at question No. 397, in reply to Mr. Pendleton, " Have you often run as assistant to the guard? " " Several times." Then, in question No. 398, "On that road ? "—" Yes." 89. " Can you form any idea as to the pace or speed ? " —He said, " No," he could not. 90. You referred to Mr. Danks's evidence, Mr. Beattie. Can you estimate fairly the speed a tram is travelling at from the pulsations ?—-I am not an old driver. 91. But you have travelled a great deal? —I could make a shot at it. 92. Do you know whether a man can estimate it correctly in a six-wheeled, as in an ordinary eight-wheel carriage?—l consider that an old driver, with the experience that Mr. Danks said he had, could estimate the speed in any carriage, even in a bogie carriage. '93. You still rely on his estimate?— Certainly. His estimate of the speed was founded on what I should consider a reliable basis. 94. About this reporting of Carter to you of the defect in this tender-brake ?—I say positively, Carter did not report that to me. 95. Do you remember having a conversation with Carter before the accident in the Addington Yards? —No, I have no recollection of it. 96. If Carter says you noted the conversation, would you say positively that he is wrong?— I simply say positively now, that I have not the slightest recollection of it. He had his own foreman, and had no business to come to me. 97. Do you never converse with engine-drivers in the yard ?—Very rarely indeed. 98. What is Carter's reputation ? Do you know the engine-drivers intimately ?—No. 99. Do you know anything about Carter's reputation as an engine-driver prior to the accident; did you look upon him as a fast driver? —I cannot say that I have any knowledge of that. 100. What official would have the best knowledge of that ?—Well I doubt whether any official would have it. 101. Supposing that a man is wanted who is known to be a man that took the best work out of his engine, who would appoint him ?—The locomotive foreman would appoint him probably after consultation with me. 102. Do you remember at any time hearing complaints about the North trains not being in time?— Yes. 103. Do you remember anything being done?— Yes. 104. When the driver who made these slow trips was put off, who was put on ?—A driver named Hyland and another named Coard. 105. Was that before or after the Bakaia accident that Hyland was put on ? —I think it was before. 106. Would you be surprised to hear it was after?—l simply spoke from memory. I should say if it was afterwards it was very shortly afterwards. 107. Might it have been afterwards ?—Yes. 108. Can you remember Carter being put on to the Culverden line ?—I have no recollection. 109. Do you remember when Hyland was put on the question was raised that he had not run as fast as he might have done in making up speed ?—Not to my knowledge. 110. Why was another driver taken off?— For the inefficient handling of his engine. 111. Was his offence that he was not making speed?— No. 112. What was the offence?— That he was not handling his engine as he should do. 113. What work is he doing now, still driving?— Yes. 114. Has he given satisfaction since?— Yes, in the work he is doing. 115: Have there been any complaints in making up time?—He has not been on work needing making up time. 116. Where has he been ?—Bunning locals and making odd journeys. 117. Does the handling of an engine entail running above the maximum speed ?—Certainly not. 118. Is it not understood that certain engine-drivers can do that—run above the maximum speed? —It is within our knowdedge and consent; certain portions of the line are given a higher rate of specd —for the express train ; beyond that I do not know. 119. Beyond that, you do not know whether speed is made up beyond express trains ?—No. 120. Do you not know it is the practice of drivers to make up speed on other trains ?—Not by exceeding their maximum. Of course, I may say here, for your information and the information of the Committee, it is not practicable to judge, or for a driver himself to judge, very closely all the time his exact rate of speed, nor is it very easy to observe a uniform speed when you are coming up- and down-hill. A certain amount of margin is necessarily allowed ; it has to be. 121. Have you no personal knowledge of Carter's reputation prior to the accident ?—I have no personal knowledge other than the records of the office. 122. Would any other officer have a more intimate knowledge than you ?—I suppose Mr. Dickenson would. 123. You cannot tell us whether Carter was likely to be selected because of his reputation of being a fast runner ?—I should certainly say not. 124. Would Mr. Dickenson be able to say whether he would be selected for a position of that kind ?— I doubt whether he could say so. 125. I think you quoted from returns from England, where in 90,000,000 passenger-train miles there were only four failures of the Westinghouse continuous brakes ?—Yes.