37

E.—3b

457. Who tells you to put the picnic suit on'? —The Brothers. 458. Do you put the suit on for that gentleman there [pointing to Mr. Thompson, Official Visitor of Industrial-school Children] ? —Yes. 459. Did you put it on for this gentleman j'pointing to Mr. Hogben, Inspector-General of Schools, and Secretary to the Education Department] ?—No. 460. Have you ever been up the hill to fetch posts down ? —Yes. 461. Could you do it easily ? —Yes. 462. What happened if the boys could not do it ?—Sometimes they would get punished, and sometimes not. 463. How many times a day have you been up ?—Once. 464. Mr. Fell.] What was your work there ? —Outside grubbing gorse and digging drains with Brother Damien. 465. Was he kind?— Yes. 466. Brother Kilian doe 3 not seem to have been kind ?—No. 467. Did he whack you?— Yes : pretty often. 468. Was he liked or disliked?— Disliked. 469. Which boy was it who hit you with a stick when Brother Kilian pitched into you ?— Morris; a middle-sized boy. 470. What sort of stick was he hitting you with ?—A little willow-stick. 471. How long ago did this happen?— Pour or five months ago. 472. Did you complain to Brother Loetus ?—No; I complained to Brother Wibertus, who complained to Brother Loetus. 473. Was any notice taken of it?—l do not know. 474. How long ago was it that Brother Wibertus kicked the boy Lane ?—Two or three years ago. 475. Was it not more than that ?—I cannot say. 476. Was any complaint made about it ? —I do not know. 477. Have you learnt to swim, and read and write?— Yes. 478. Have you ever complained to Father Mahoney of ill-treatment or of bad clothes ?—No. When I did not have enough clothes I would ask for them. I had sufficient clothes. 479. Did you get plenty to eat ?—Yes ; when I wanted more I could always get it by holding up my hand. 480. Mr. Hogben.] Now, about the boy who was kicked against the wall. I want you to tell me what standard you are in now ?—The Fourth. 481. Did you pass the Third Standard last year ?—Yes. 482. Did you pass the Second Standard the year before?— No. 483. Did you fail two years in the Second Standard?— Yes. 484. Did you fail for the First Standard ?—No. 485. Did you fail for the Third Standard ? —Yes, twice; and passed the third time. 486. You have not passed the Fourth Standard yet ?—No. 487. Do you remember what class you were in when the boy was kicked?—l think it was the third. 488. Were you learning geography then ?—No; I was learning history. 489. You did not learn history in the Second Standard ? —No. 490. Were you learning history when the boy was kicked ?—No. 491. Then you were in the Second Standard then?— Yes. 492. Do you have milk in your porridge ? —Yes, always. 493. Do you have sugar in your porridge ?—No; but it tasted as if it had sugar in it. 494. Do you have milk in your tea ?—Yes. 495. Did you have puddings before these gentlemen [meaning the Board] came to see you?— Yes ; plum-pudding at Christmas and on holidays, but no other pudding. 496. Did you have baked rice or baked sago ?—No. 497. Have you had it since the gentlemen came ?—Yes. 498. Was there any milk put in it ?—I do not know ;it was white. 499. Were the boys punished always with a supplejack?— Yes. 500. Were the number of strokes counted out to you beforehand, or as given ?—No. 501. Were you punished with a strap?—No ; but we have been lately. 502. Was nobody else present beside the Brother when you were punished ?—No one. 503. Mr. Bush.] Were there cows in milk in the Orphanage ?—Yes, four or five ; but not all the year round.

Chaeles John Haeley, examined on oath. The Witness : I have been one of the town members of the Nelson Charitable Aid Board for about eighteen months. I have often been to the Orphanage, but not since I have been a member of the Board, except at the end of May. A good deal of comment was occasioned in the town when the boy James asked to be punished by the police instead of being sent back to the Orphanage. Persistent rumours got about that boys were being ill-treated, and the members of the Board determined to pay a surprise visit. Messrs. Eout, Piper, Hay ward, and myself went and were met as already described. Brother Augustine took Messrs. Eout and Piper upstairs. I went with Mr. Hayward through the building into the playground, where there were a large number of boys— upwards of a hundred—playing about. When they saw us there, Mr. Hayward called to two or three of them who are put there by the Board. The boys crowded round us, and we had a good look at them. As regards clothing they were very ragged—very oddly dressed. A number had toes through their boots, others hair through their hats. The clothes were torn; they were ill-