,T. a. WILSON.]

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he should teach what you think ought to be taught —what ought he to know ? —He ought to know something of botany; he ought to know something of chemistry; he ought to have a considerable knowledge of gardening, and be able to go out and impart the interest that he has in ordinary country life to the children 61. Will you give us your idea as to where that ought to be taught to the teacher in order to prepare him? —Those things can only be taught to the teachers in the centres. 62. In training colleges? —In training colleges if possible. There is no reason why you should not have classes of this agricultural nature in your universities. In almost all the English universities they have extensions in that connection, and most of them have professors of agriculture. Such men as these could have classes, and these teachers ought to be available. The difficulty, of course, is the cost here. The Macdonald Institute is providing means by which you can, in Canada, send teachers there and have them boarded for a reasonable sum. Here we have not that opportunity. 63. Are you acquainted with the recommendations made by the Committee last year and printed in the blue-books with regard to training colleges for teachers? —I saw something of them, but Ido not recollect at the moment what the recommendations were. They occurred to me as being valuable. 64. From what you know of the training of teachers, do you think it wise that the training should be through the means, first of all, of pupil-teachership, and then training-college education, or should it be from the primary school to the high school, and from the high school to the training college ? Which would be the more valuable man as a teacher —one who was trained in the former way or one who was trained in the latter ? —I have not made a study of that, and I have not any special knowledge which would make my opinion at all valuable. 65. What is a peripatetic teacher? What is he to teach? Who is he to teach? —He is to teach the teacher, first of all, as far as possible. He —and I refer to females as well as males —goes to a school, takes up a certain subject, gives the children a lesson on it, and demonstrates to the teacher who watches him how to teach the children at this particular point. 66. How long is he to stay at one school to teach the teacher? —Do you not think that is a question of detail? 67. I think the whole question is a matter of detail? —I should say it depends on the amount of money you are prepared to spend. 68. You say that he must know botany. How long would it take the peripatetic teacher to teach the teacher if the latter did not know botany? —Is it possible for a teacher nowadays to go through the course and not understand elementary botany and elementary chemistry? 69. I am assuming that it is possible? —Then he need not expect ihe peripatetic teacher to teach him those subjects. 70. You made use of the expression " the level of education." What did you mean by that? — I say that in some districts of New Zealand governed by Education Boards the level of education is lower than it is in others —that is to say, that the system and the amount of education a child can get at the schools is not so good as it is elsewhere, or it is better, as the case may be. 71. Mr. Fowlds.] The Council of Education would bring the education up to the level?—l think the working of the Council would have that effect. The Council would have the overlooking of the whole of New Zealand. It would know what was going on all over New Zealand —not like the Education Boards, that cannot tell what is going on across their own borders. 72. Mr. J. Allen\ That seems to imply that you favour a Council of Education that is central and not local? —How do you mean —" local "? 73. Shall I say " provincial " ? —I do not mean that it should be a Council for each province or each district. I mean that the Council of Education should have the supervision of the educational part of the work of New Zealand, but have nothing to do with the details of schoolmanagement, and so on. 74. Do you think the Council of Education should take over some of the functions of the Education Boards? —Yes, as far as education is concerned, but it should have nothing to do with the details of management of the schools, or anything in connection with the Committees. The Council would not have executive power, but the Minister being at the head of it would surely, if he were wise, or if there were good to come from the Council at all, carry out the conclusions arrived at. 75. The Chairman.] I understand you to suggest an advisory body, pure and simple?— You could not have an executive body. 76. Mr. J. Allen.] I understand Mr. Wilson suggests a body that should bring all the education in the various districts up to or down to the same level. Is that so? —This is a very wide subject. 77. I only touched on it because I did not know what you meant " by the level of education." The only other point I wish to 'ask you about is with regard to the training given in the United States and Canada. Are you aware, Mr. Wilson, that in the United States of America the central Federal Bureau, for instance, freely distributes reports? —Most freely. 78. They distribute them very widely —they spend a lot of money in doing so? —Yes, a great deal, and we ought to spend more. There are very valuable papers which nobody gets hold of in New Zealand. They are sent to post-offices, and if asked for are delivered free, but I think they ought to be posted. lam afraid a great many would be wasted; but an effort ought to be made to get these papers down to the farmers and to get them to read the papers. 79. Are you aware that in America there has been a great growth of Farmers' Institutes, which have educated the farmers up to reading and making use of these reports ?- Yes; I have alluded to that. I may say that in the United States they have a man at the head of agriculture who is a great educationalist himself —the Hon. James Wilson.