G.—s.

168

[hone here.

too. I have been looking through a lot of American papers in regard to the American system of teaching native Indians—that is, apart from Booker Washington's College, where he teaches his own people. It struck me forcibly that the American system of teaching the native Indians is a very fine one. They do not limit themselves to the teaching of one particular trade to all the boys in a school. That is the fault at St. Stephen's at the present time, where the only trade being taught to the boys is carpentry. You do not want that; you want more trades taught, because the tastes of boys differ. In America they have boys learning saddlery, blacksmithing, carpentry —in fact, many trades; and that is the kind of additional equipment I should like to see added to our schools where higher education is taught. In regard to girls, I have very little knowledge as to what would be the best course for them. Teaching them how to manage a home, and all that, is very good, and 1 think nursing is one of the best things that could be taught the girls of keener intellect. If such girls go amongst the Natives they would tend to educate the parents, and bring about an improvement in the upbringing of Native children ; and it is very necessary the Native parents should be educated in regard to these points. That is one of the weak spots at present. But it must be remembered that there are many features to be considered in this regard. There is the question of means to enable them to improve their houses and surroundings, to enable them to acquire food and proper clothing. All these things have to be considered in regard to the destruction of Native life, and I am afraid the knowledge of these nurses would go for little if the parents are confronted with this want of means. However, that is a matter for us as their parliamentary representatives to consider. We must try to secure an improvement in regard to the land question, which is really the only basis by which the Natives can equip themselves with the means to bring about necessary improvements in their home-life. Ido not think I have anythink more to say. 10. What have you to say in regard to the question of free places in these colleges? —I think these colleges ought to be free, and I think prominence ought to be given to children of the tribal donors of the land in every instance where land has been set aside for educational purposes. 11. What do you think of the expediency of the co-education of both races?—l do not think it does any harm, In fact, so far as my opinion is concerned, I think it is a very good thing on the whole. 12. Would you suggest that Te Aute should be kept as a school entirely for Natives, or would you admit Europeans?—l would suggest it should be kept entirely for Natives. There is no objection to Europeans being taught at the same school, but you must consider the question of sufficient accommodation for Maori boys. That is the first consideration. 13. Have you anything to say on behalf of the Native people in regard to their right to participate in the benefits derived from the Wanganui School Trust?—My opinion in regard to the Wanganui Trust, notwithstanding that it differs from the other trusts, is that the intention of the late Governor Grey was to enable the Natives of the Wanganui tribes to enter that school. That being my reading of the grant, it appears to me that an opening should be made for some Maori boys from, say, the Coverimient public schools or Native village schools to enter that College free. 14. Do you consider that the Natives have had their fair share of the benefits intended to be given to them by that trust?—No, I do not think the Natives have had any share in the benefits of Wanganui College. So far as I know, every Native boy who has entered that College had to pay. 15. I wish to ask you a very important question, and I will put it plainly: In order to provide for the instruction of the children of parents dissenting from the religious doctrines to be taught in any such school, are you of opinion that, upon application to be made by their parents or guardians, they should be taught in these schools without being instructed in the doctrines of religion ? In other words, do you think these schools should be entirely secular ?—That is my opinion. I hold very strong opinions in regard to religious instruction in any school, whether it is under the control of the Church of England, the Presbyterian Church, or any other Church. Where children belonging to another denomination attend these schools, I think first of all the consent of the parents ought to be obtained before these children are compelled to attend any of the school services. If the parents do not consent, then their children ought to be excluded from such services. These children have their own churches near by, and. they ought to be allowed to attend service at their respective places of worship. 16. The grant for the Wanganui Industrial School says " religious instruction " is to be one of the purposes for which the grant was issued, and, the grant being to Bishop Selwyn, I suppose you would agree that the religious instruction referred to in the grant meant religious instruction in the tenets of the Church of England?—l take that to be the meaning of it. 17. But, do you agree that, although that is so, it was never intended it should be to the exculsion of boys of other denominations? —No; I do not think that was ever the intention of Sir George Grey. He was a man of very broad ideas. 18. You agree that religious instruction in the tenets of the Church of England would be in compliance with the grant, but that the children of parents of other denominations should not be excluded in consequence of their difference of opinion on religious questions?—l should take that to be the position. It is only fair. It is only common-sense. Surely teaching the tenets of one particular Church was not intended to prevent educational benefits being extended to children belonging to other denominations? 19. I do not know whether you have read the Ordinances passed in 1847, but G.-4, section 3, reads as follows: "In every school to be established or supported by public funds under the provisions of this Ordinance religious education, industrial training, and instruction in the English language shall form a, necessary part of the system to be pursued therein; but in order to provide for the instruction of the children of parents dissenting from the religious doctrines to be taught in any such school, such children as shall attend the same as day-scholars only may, upon application to be made in that behalf by their parents or guardians, be taught therein without being instructed in the doctrines of religion." Do you agree that these words, "such children as shall