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" to co-operate with any Colonies desiring immigrants in assisting suitable " persons to emigrate." As I have stated already the first paragraph, as to which Canada has no dissenting voice, does not require any discussion. But we thought with regard to the second paragraph, that perhaps it was intended by the Government of Australia that the Imperial Government should be invited to co-operate financially in a scheme for bringing emigrants to the new Countries beyond the seas. We approach this subject from the point of view of Canada, with the statement that we have no grievance at all. At the present moment we are quite satisfied with our position in that regard. In fact, we have undertaken ourselves to manage our own immigration, and so far, we have no reason to complain of the result of our efforts; but of course it goes without saying, that if the Imperial Government are prepared to help and assist us financially we would be only too glad to co-operate with them. Listening to Mr. Deakin very carefully I did not understand that he had even-any such project in his mind. If properly appreciated the tenour of his remarks, he rather thought that the Imperial Government under existing circumstances were not doing all they might do, or were doing it in a way w : hich was not satisfactory to the Government of Australia. For my own part I would be glad to hear again from Mr. Deakin what practical suggestion he has to make to implement what is contained in this paragraph. Mr. DEAKIN : Sir Wilfrid, our difficulty was when we considered the schemes that we ourselves would like to see adopted, how far we ought to approach the Imperial Government with any definite suggestion, inasmuch as they might consider that this implied at all events that we were better judges of their business than they were. Now we can only claim that at our end of the immigration movement we are entitled to speak from our own experience as to wdiat we want. But as to the particular means by which immigration could be fostered here, we have a good deal of hesitation. Our first idea was a reform of existing methods. I have no personal quarrel with the Emigration Board. I have spoken upon information supplied me, and am not singling out the Emigration Board or the Department with which it is associated from any other Department. But our experience in Australia is —and it may possibly be not confined to the Commonwealth —that it is not possible to constitute a public department of officials for any purpose, however excellent, of any men, however capable, who will not sooner or later, and probably soon, lose touch with the changing conditions of the practical work with which they were originally created to deal. For ourselves it is only by constant Parliamentary vigilance, by perpetual Parliamentary criticism, by influence brought to bear through the responsible Ministers, that we are able to keep our own departments in some degree up to the requirements of our own country. I should suspect that the experience everywhere is the same. It is not the fault of the individual so much as it is the fact you cannot have a department without a system, and when once you stereotype the system you begin to check the individual energy, initiative power and free criticism of the men engaged in it, While you cannot live without your bureaucracy, and while the democracy needs it specially, with us the constant attention of the representatives of the people is required to be devoted to our own departments. We have to confess that they do not satisfy us. Consequently, if I may be pardoned for the digression, I am not trying to select the Emigration Board for comments which I have had occasion to make upon other departments. There will always be differences between ourselves and our departments. While departments are necessary agencies of governments, they are in my opinion in inevitable opposition, so to speak, to the re-adaptations and fresh adaptations called for by the circumstances of each case. Ido not say that any one statement in that objectionable circular was untrue, but I do say

Sixth Day. 25 April 1907!

Emigration. (Sir Wilfrid Laurier.)