365

A.—s

altogether stationary, but there is no very distinct advance in the figures. Then, about 1895—and that is why lam taking that year—there is a sudden rise in the trade of all these countries. For the first five years following 1895 Germany on the whole lessened the distance betweeifher trade and ours. She increased her exports of manufactures by 40,000,000/., we only increased ours by 28,000,000/., excluding the value of new ships, as to which we have no information prior to 1899. In the last five years Germany has increased her trade by 42,000,000/., and we have increased our trade by 44,000,000/., excluding ships. Including ships, the value of our exports of manufactured goods in 1906 amounted to 311,000,000/, while the best estimate we can make as to the value of the German exports of manufactured goods in 1906 is 208,000,000/. It is only fair to state, however, that this estimate is based upon prices ruling during 1905, and that it may consequently be found, when official figures are available, to be somewhat below the mark. Mr. DEAKIN : I do not wish to divert you from your argument in the least, but can you put your finger on the particular causes which seem to have operated between those two quinquennial periods—anything in the world's harvest or other circumstances which would account for the universal stoppage in the first, and then the general advance in the second ? Mr. LLOYD GEORGE : 1 wonder whether peace had something to do with it. Mr. DEAKIN : Was not 1890 to 1895 peaceful t I think so. Mr. LLOYD GEORGE : I really have not gone into that matter, and should not like to express a hasty opinion about it. I understand from Mr. Llewellyn Smith, who is the Permanent Secretary of the Department over which I preside, that there was a general depression throughout the world at that time, the cause of which I could not at present explain. But undoubtedly there have been good times since then. What I want to impress upon the Conference is this : that we have profited by those good times to a larger extent than any foreign country so far as foreign trade is concerned; and lam taking our three greatest trade rivals. It is really a remarkable fact. The United States has endless resources of raw material, to begin with, which we cannot compare with for a moment, We have, for instance, to get our iron ore from Spain, and Sweden, and the ends of the earth; the same is the case with our copper; and we have to get our raw cotton from thousands of miles across the sea; whereas the United States of America have got these things at their feet. We have to bring them all here and then start manufacturing, after paying for the carriage of the raw material. Mr. DEAKIN : Very often railway carriage for a short distance is heavier than shipping carriage for a long distance. We have found that so. Mr. LLOYD GEORGE : But take the case of Pittsburg; there is no carriage of raw materials there; they have their iron ore, coal, gas, and oil practically all in the same factory. There has never been anything like it in the whole history of the world, and yet in spite of that we beat the United States of America by more than 2 to 1. Mr. DEAKIN: In iron? Mr. LLOYD GEORGE : I will come to that. In the export of manufactured goods, we beat them by more than 2to 1. Then Mr. Deakin asks me

Eleventh Day. 6 May IIHI7.

I'KEI EKI;\ l| v. Trade. (Mr. Lloyd George.)