A.—sa

78

REPORT OF I'ROCEEDINQS OF THE CONFERENCE.

Hon. W. M. HUGHES: It is. It is not, however, wider than we want. The CHAIRMAN : It is wider than, I think, we could possibly accept. Sir WILLIAM LY'NE : The discussion that has taken place does not quite, in any of its forms, meet what was in my mind at the commencement. What was in my mind was : Caii we possibly make a limit of a dennition as to where our coastal laws, or wi«,»«- ..inlaws, shall terminate, or to where they shall extend.' That is what is really in my mind. The thing would oe simplified altogether if we could possibly make a limit on the line of demarcation, embracing those places to which our laws would apply. 1 did not want to get into ttiese technicalities that we have been getting into in our discussion, but can we say that the laws oi Australia and .New Zealand shall extend so far East, so far W est, so far .N orth, and so far South ? That is the point 1 really wanted to get at. The CHAIRMAN : This is a very big constitutional issue, which 1 am afraid we are hardly competent to decide in this Conference. Sir WILLIAM LYNE : One moment. If you look at the map of Queensland you will find there is a line of demarcation which runs very nearly across Torres Strait up to the Mainland. You will find it on the map marked right up 1 do not know how far beyond Queensland; 1 was very much surprised when I found it out, and I found it out in ascertaining the extent to which certain Queensland laws took effect, and I was very much surprised to find that. What 1 wanted now is exactly the same thing as that—the principle is there, and if you could get that I should be very much obliged. Mr. GOX : Speaking from memory, I think all within that limit has been dehned, and annexed and made part of Queensland. Mr. NORMAN HILL : Just one point I wanted to clear up with reference to the resolution passed just before lunch —that is Resolution No. 9. 1 do not want to go back in any way on that resolution. You were not here, sir, at the time, but Mr. Anderson and I ventured to put forward some considerations that we wanted the Commonwealth and New Zealand to have regard to as to vessels engaged incidentally in the coasting trade We only put it forward as a suggestion as to what was expedient. Now, sir, we voted for the resolution and supported the resolution, and we have conceded that they have a right to enforce the resolution as it stands. But, sir, we are only representing others, and if that resolution is published we would like to have also published what we have ventured to submit, not as an amendment to the resolution, but as a rider, and if that could be put and disposed of I should be glad. lam not sure whether we convinced our friends from the Commonwealth. The CHAIRMAN : Did you propose that rider? Mb. NORMAN HILL: Mr. Llewellyn Smith suggested I should propose it just after lunch, but we got on to these other discussions. The CHAIRMAN : We are in the middle of another thing. Sib WILLIAM LY'NE : If you will allow me one moment, Mr. Mills has just placed in my hand an award, or a decision of our Arbitration Court, given only a few months ago :—".The following rates of pay "and conditions take effect on the Ist January, 1907," (and, therefore, legally or illegally, that is in force "to-day) "and remain in force for a period of three years, and apply to all vessels, excepting tugs, tenders, "banana, and sugar droghers, within the Common- " wealth or on any voyage from part to part of the " Commonwealth, or on any voyage to New Zealand, New "Caledonia, or the Fiji Group, which begins and "ends within the Commonwealth." That is in force now. Mb. COX : That is in Section 5 of the Commonwealth Act. Hon. W. M. HUGHES: That is not the law; it is an agreement enforceable at law. The CHAIRMAN : That is an agreement entered into with the Colonies. This is the notice of motion

handed in to me by Mr. Norman Hill:—"That the " Conference is of opinion -that as a matter of ex- " pediency oversea vessels which only engage in the "Colonial coasting trade by taking passengers or cargo "between Colonial ports of call, should not be deemed "to engage in the coastal trade." Mr. NORMAN HILL: It is what I put just before lunch, and 1 have said all 1 have to say. Mr. Anderson supported it, and if you could deal with it on the paper when you publish the resolution that has been already passed, we should be glad. 'The CHAIRMAN : All you want is to get it on the notes, and when we send the report to the papers, in that report there would be an intimation that the shipowners wished this to be added as a rider. Sir JOSEPH WARD : If it is given as an opinion, I see no objection. Mu. NORMAN HILL: No; the resolution will be published to-morrow, and I would like to have pub lished, also, that we suggest this, and that either you accept or reject it. The CHAIRMAN : May I read it again :—" The (on " feience is of opinion that, as a matter of expediency, "oversea vessels which only engage in the Colonial " coasting trade by taking passengers or cargo between " Colonial ports of call, should not be deemed to engage '' in the coastal trade.'' Sib WILLIAM LYNE : Oh, no. Hon. W. M. HUGHES : We cannot agree to that. Mr. NORMAN HILL : Then let it be said that it is rejected. The CHAIRMAN : I understand this is not accepted by the Colonial representatives ? Sir WILLIAM LYNE : Certainly not. The CHAIRMAN : There cannot be any objection to this going on the notes as a proposal by the shipowners. Have you any objection? It is really for the protection of the shipowners. Sib JOSEPH WARD : I will give my reason for objecting. My reason is the fact that our laws are against it. Hon. W. M. HUGHES : Can we have that typed before we go —the one Mr. Hill has just given to you, sir: The CHAIRMAN : It simply goes into the papers as their suggestion. The other will appear as the resolution which has been adopted by the Conference. Hon. W. M. HUGHES : It is going to appear in the press. The CHAIRMAN : As the counter proposal of the shipowners. Hon W. M .HUGHES : The one that was carried was, I understand, carried unanimously. The CHAIRMAN : Yes, subject to the proposals of the shipowners. Hon. W. M. HUGHES: It was carried unanimously. Mb. LLEWELLYN SMITH : Yes, that is so. This is a rider merely. Sib WILLIAM LY'NE : There was a question arose the other day which came before the Conference, but was not decided owing to your absence, sir, and that was as to the information that might be given, at any rate, to the Australians. The CHAIRMAN : Yes. Mr. Llewellyn Smith wired me about it. Sib WILLIAM LYNE : We do not care about the British press at all, but we do care about Australia, and they complain very bitterly that they do not get more information. I think that they will force things, so as to get information, and I wanted to bring the matter before the Conference.