H.—24.

148

|_D. BARRON.

the land at less than the value of the timber, and it would assist him to carry on and still have the timber utilised. It would be a benefit to him and a slight loss to the country, but the benefit to him would be greater than the loss to the country. 6. Hon. the Chairman.] You have also to- take into consideration the value of the timber in cutting it up? —It was all valued before I came to the district, but the upset price was not put on. It will be only after the sections carrj'ing timber are opened for application that they will be reconsidered and revalued. I may say the timber throughout is patchy in its distribution, first-class timber being scarce, and consequently expensive to bring from the mill to the market. The only thing I have not been asked is the average yield per acre. I estimate that to be from 3,000 ft. to 4,000 ft. only, so that you see the timber is very much scattered. The latest figures show the average output per acre to be from three and a half to four million feet in this - district in a year. Of course, there has been great destruction of timber by settlers in the past, a large quantity having been felled and burnt, but during the last six or seven years (lie destruction lias practically ceased on account of the land being to a great extent locked up. As I mentioned before, it is necessary for the settlers to destroy the timber in order to comply with the conditions. 7. Mr. Arnold.] Now, a number of those settlers destroyed about two-thirds of the bush, and then, for various reasons, they permitted their leases to fall in ? —-Yes, in a very few eases, but not so much as it was in Southland. 8. I was speaking principally of Catlin's?—Yes. 9. Now those areas are growing wild; there is an undergrowth springing up all over the place, the areas are useless to-day, and will become more so as time goes on in consequence of this growth ? —Yes. 10. There being noxious weeds in addition to the ordinary growth that springs up after bushfelling?—Yes. 11. Now, can the Department do anything to prevent that?— When the settlers have deserted the land, as you mentioned, it is impossible to do-anything except at very great expense —perhaps at greater expense than the land is worth. . 12. Are you willing to let those areas, or are they amongst those areas you mentioned? —I do not think there are many holdings in this district deserted. They appear to be deserted, but they are held in some way. 13. But there are hundreds of acres of such land as that? —Yes, but there are very few that are actually deserted. 14. Will you let the Commission know the number? —Yes, I will make out a list of those deserted. [Subsequently supplied: 32 sections; area, 4,079 acres.] 15. Mr. Jennings.] Is the land around this district suitable for agricultural purposes when the bush is removed? —No, some of it is very poor indeed. 16. Speaking generally, what is the average? —It is fair average to medium, but there is none that could be called first-class. 17. What is your experience in regard to the destruction of bush, apart from the destruction of timber by the settlers. Taking into consideration the reserves and so forth—has the fire got into the bush? —Not to a great extent. In the lakes district it has got into the bush, but, fortunately or unfortunately, the bush is not of very good quality. 18. Can you furnish the Commission with particulars as to the amount of bush destroyed outside during the last fifteen or twenty years? —Yes, I could do that. 19. Mi , . Field.] Have you jurisdiction over Southland? —No. The reason £ referred to Southland just now was because I was there three years before I came to Otago, and I knew the conditions well. 20. How long ago?— Eight years. 21. Do you know anj'thing about the grievance of Mr. Wallis?—Yes. 22. Do you think he has personally suffered any injury?—l do not know that he has suffered any personal injury. 23. Can you say whether Mr. Wallis has done fairly well out of his dealings in Government land? —I do not know that. Of course, he was engaged in sawmilling before I went to Southland, and during the greater part of the time I was there he was engaged in farming, and took up sawmilling afterwards. 24. You said that the timber , industry had a good deal to contend with? —Yes. 25. Do you know whether or not the timber industry in Otago and Southland at the present time is in a nourishing condition?—l do not think they arc making much money in Otago. 26. Mr. Ell.] With regard to the land in the Catlin's district, you say a good deal of it is not fit for agricultural purposes?— Yes, it is fair to medium. It depends on the man who works it, but the land on the whole is only from poor to medium right throughout the district. 27. I understood you to say some portion of it was not fit for settlement? —Yes, there is some of it not fit for settlement; it is too rough, too broken, and when the timber is cleared and burnt the grass will live for a year or two, and then the scrub and weeds take possession. 28. Is that due to the climatic conditions? —To the poor nature of the subsoil. 29. Was any such land open for settlement?— Yes. When all that land was opened for settlement the bulk of it was understood to be first-class land, but a great part of it turned out to be very bad land. 30. Did an expert officer examined it to see whether it was fit for settlement?—lt was before my time. I have only been here eight years, and the bulk of it was surveyed before I came to this district. 31. And, so far as your knowledge is concerned, that was not done?—l do not think so. If I may be allowed to say, I think the mistake made at the start was this: that part of the bush was surveyed in the very centre, and instead of working it from the outside gradually, and perhaps taking the railway with it, it was surveyed all over, and settlement put into the middle of the