54

1.-14.

W. SYMES.

132. Now, Mr. Symes, may I take it that this sum of £300 and the amounts which have been mentioned in connection with the west coast Native reserves are the sole moneys received by you in connection with any matter affecting the Government? —That is so. 133. Now, I want to take you through the list of west coast reserves, but I want just to put one or two questions to see that I understand the matter, you to tell me that you had no arrangement, express or otherwise, with the lessees to receive any commission of any sort or kind until after the moneys had been appropriated by Parliament? —Precisely 134. Secondly, that the arrangement under which you received commission was commission for collecting the money from the Treasury?— That is so. 135 And made after the moneys had been appropriated by Parliament? —That is so. 136. And then commissions were paid to you after the moneys had been received from the Treasury?— That is so. 137 Mr Myers ] Mr Symes, may we take it that when you communicated with the then Prime Minister, Mr Hall-Jones, with regard to the acquisition of Mr. Alfred Bayly's property, you were acting solely as a member of Parliament? —Yes. 138. In the interests of your district? —Yes. 139 And in no way as agent for Mr Bayly?—ln no way whatever 140. You recommended strongly, did you not, as your letter shows, the acquisition of the estate?— Yes. Whatever I felt at that time and whatever I wrote was correct. 141 Well, Alfred Bayly told you, according to your evidence, that he regarded the purchase of the estate as due to your exertions? —Yes. 142 Did you agree with him?— Well, the only exertion I had was through the letter and my explanation. 143 Do you agree that it was clue to your exertions or influence in any way that this property was acquired? —No, I do not think so. '144. If you considered that Alfred Bayly was wrong in thinking that the acquisition of the property was due to your exertions, why did you accept the £300? —I did not accept anything in connection with the sale of the property 145 Well, Alfred Bayly, according to you, said that he was giving you the £300 because he wanted you to have it as it was owing to your exertions that the property had been acquired.. If you say" now that it was not due to your exertions or influence that the property was acquired in any way, why did you, I ask you,'accept the £300?— I did not know what was in Mr. Alfred Bayly's mind. 'l said" to- him that I did not claim anything in connection with the sale of the property, nor had I acted in any way or in any capacity on his behalf 146 But according to your own evidence I put it to you that you did know what was in Alfred Bayly's mind, because he said to you that the acquisition of the property was due to your'exertions. Did you not say that? —I think so. 147 Then, if you say that your exertions had nothing to do with it —and this is the last time I shall ask you—why did you accept the £300?— I accepted it as a present from Mr. Bayly at his special solicitation, but not in connection with the sale of the property at all. 148. Mr Bayly said to you, according to your evidence, " I have to thank you for the sale ' ? Yes. 149 Did Mr Bayly have to thank you for the sale? —I said that he did not. 150. Then why did you take his £300, seeing that was the reason why he was offering it to y OU 'I. I declined to accept it on the sale of the land. 151 But you succumbed finally to the temptation ?—Not for the sale of the land though. 152 Well why did you take it, seeing that that was the reason he gave to you why he was offering you the money?—Mr Bayly assured me that if I did not accept it as a present from him he would be very hurt and offended. 153 But why did you not say to him., " You have not to thank me for the sale, it was not through my exertions, and therefore you are offering me £300 because you think I got you this money I will not take it," Why did you not say that, and refuse to take it?—l brought the whole matter under the notice of the Government through the petition, and I suppose that is why he considered I was entitled to consideration—not for the sale of the property He considered that I had through bringing the matter before the Government, effected the sale of the property 154. Well, what did you think he meant when he said, I have to thank you for the sale "? 155. Now, this payment was made to you in September, 1906, was it not—that is the date of the promissory note?— Yes. 156. There was no election in that year, was there?—No, but there had been one the year 3V 157 Now lam going to leave that transaction altogether Now with regard to the other transactions, do you say that there were no politics about the matter at all—that it was purely a business matter?— All business. 158. Did you discuss with any of the people who received moneys from the Government as refunds this political aspect of the matter?— No. _ 159 Now I want to read to you two letters amongst those which my friend has put in, and to ask 'you whether these are two letters you received. Mr Newland, you say, was one of the nrincinal men in the matter? —Yes. 160 Did you receive this letter from him, dated 11th August, 1905 I only got the petition back from Hawera last night, but take the first opportunity of sending it to you In sending it back they made no suggestion as to who was to come down and give evidence, so please let me know when it will be likely to be heard, and I will not fail to get some one or come myself Some I have spoken to seem to be afraid they are not of the right colour What does that mean?-l could not say Ido not know what was in Mr Newland's mind.