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9th Day.] Universal Penny Postage. [15 June, 1911. Mr. SAMUEL : Is that so? Sir JOSEPH WARD : Yes. Mr. SAMUEL : The information supplied me was that those were the only supporters. Sir WILFRID LAURIER : We stood in a subordinate position; but I would favour it, for my part. Mr. SAMUEL : The information supplied me from the records—I hope it is correct —is, that the United States and Egypt were the only countries supporting. Sir D. de VILLIERS GRAAFF : That is so. Sir JOSEPH WARD : Dr. Coulter, the Deputy Postmaster-General, told me in Ottawa, when I passed through a few weeks ago, that he supported it, and that it was expected by the representatives of the British Government that he would vote against it, but he did not, and he supported it. The question afterwards arose in the Canadian House of Parliament, and Sir Wilfrid Laurier made a statement to that effect. Mr. SAMUEL : Then my information must be incorrect; but the other countries of the world did not support the Resolution, and even the proposal to reduce the minimum from to 2d., supported by Great Britain, was rejected, and the only alteration made was an increase in the weight allowed. I wish I could see my way to support Sir Joseph Ward's Resolution, but in view of the very heavy expenditure which'this country is now incurring for social reforms, and also for the purposes of defence, I regret to say that the Government cannot give its adhesion to the proposal. Sir WILFRID LAURIER : I would support the motion on principle. I think it is a very forward policy. It chiefly concerns the United Kingdom. So far as Canada is concerned we have very little trade relations with any country except the United States and the United Kingdom. Our relations with the outside world are very limited. I would favour the resolution on the whole. Mr. FISHER : The Commonwealth is in this position : As regards postage to-day it has penny postage throughout the world to any country that will reciprocate. We can hardly go any further. If any country will reciprocate with us we give it penny postage. That is our policy, and therefore, of course, we must support this proposal. We do not propose in the meantime to give penny postage to a country where they are charging us 1\d. or dd:, but as soon as they are ready to accept penny postage we will agree with them. Sir D. de VILLIERS GRAAFF : We have made several concessions in the Union in the Post Office as well as the Telegraph service, and we have established penny postage, not only with the Mother Country but all the British Dominions, with the exception of a few islands; but, generally, so far as we are concerned, in the British Dominions our postage is Id. I am now advised that if we adopt the universal penny postage the loss would be too great for the Union, and, therefore, whilst we are quite at one with the principle, and approve Of the principle, and would gladly see the rate altered, but so far as we are concerned not at once, as we prefer for the present to stand out on account of the loss of revenue that would ensue. I may say in a sense there is universal penny postage by means of the penny postcard, which is already an accomplished fact. The foreign postcard rate practically all over the world is Id., and the postcard enjoys all the privileges of a letter, except that of absolute