H. G. MORGAN.

53

1.—13 a.

appoints six out of twelve members — half the Council. Why should primary-school touchers elect members to Victoria College Council, when the Education Boards are represented? If primary-school teachers are to be represented, why should teachers in secondary and technical schools not be represented .' By the same token doctors, lawyers, clergymen, and other professional men ought to be represented. 1 had almost forgotten to mention the undergraduate student as worthy oi' representation. The climax of futile representation is, i think, reached in the case of Canterbury College, where three representatives are elected by members of School Committees, as well as three by primary-school teachers. The system <>i giving primary-school teachers and members of School Committees direct representation in the University is entirely wrong, ii is putting the cart before the horse with a vengeance. The University authorities should have some say in both primary and secondary education, bin to :_ r i\v primary teachers and school committeenien, as such, votes in controlling the University, although they have practically no *;iy in the matter of primary education, seems ridiculous in the extreme. Recommendations as to government of the University: The ultimate form that the highest governing body of the University— namely, the Senate —should take must be determined largely by the nature of am reforms that may be decided upon. As 1 have already indicated, 1 do not, for the present, advocate ail}' great change in the personnel or mode of election of the Senate. 1 cannot say how it should be elected until 1 know what system of education in the University is h> be carried out in tin- future. For each college there should be two bodies with administrative functions, one concerned mainly with financial questions, the other with academic control. The financial body, which by virtue of its controlling the sinews of war would prevail in any conflict of authority with the academic body, should be elected on as broadly democratic a basis as possible. In the academic body tiie professors should have the controlling voice. Besides the general public (represented by the Governor in Council), graduates and also under-graduates should have a representative. It is clearly impossible that one man should be able to suggest the cure for all the evils under which the University .labours. The lack of funds, however, is the greatest single drawback to University efficiency. In order that the subject of reform may be adequately investigated, 1 advocate, as stated at the beginning of these remarks, a Hoyal Commission to consider the subject of education in New Zealand in all its branches. 3. The Chairman.] Have you thought anything about the yresonnel of the proposed Itoyal Commision?—l have not given any thought to it, but I presume it would be very much on the samelines as the Royal Commission of Victoria. 4. How was that constituted ? —-I do not know exactly. Of course the Government would be represented, and 1 suppose the University Council and the graduates. 5. You have not thought carefully over the subject?— No. 6. Do you think the qualifications to sit on such a Commission are the same as those required to consider primary education —do you think the Bame Commission would be a proper one to consider both questions? —I have not thought that out. It might possibly be desirable to have three separate Commissions if there were difficulties as regards the personnel. I think that primary, secondary, and university education ought to be co-ordinated, and from this point of view one Commission rather than three would be desirable. 7. When you speak of the fees being abolished, do you suggest that they should be abolished for all matriculated students?- —Not necessarily for those who do not reach a certain standard. 8. What standard do you suggest? —The credit pass of the Junior Scholarship Examination. 9. Is that not done at the present time? Are those who pass with credit not entitled to a bursary?—l believe that is so, but I did not think of. that at the time I spoke. I held a Junior Scholarship and paid fees. 10. You were not aware that a bursary in that case was equal to the class fees? —No. 1 think the matriculation standard ought to be raised, but we ought not to begin raising the matriculation standard until the funds are available for a free University. 11. When you said that an assessor should act with the professors when examining for a degree, in what way did you propose to bring about a uniformity or standard in connection with the four colleges? —Th"c professors might meet together and could arrange that only two should act at any one college. Two might examine, say, at the Otago University, and two at the other colleges. 12. But in what way do you propose the assessor should act i I understand you to suggest now that the examination should be on the lines mentioned in the pamphlet—namely, that the four professors should act as an Examining Board? —Not necessarily. 1 am not wedded to any form of examination. I think there might be an external examiner acting with a professor. 13. If you had the four professors acting as a Board, would you have external examiners too? —Not if the four were examining. 14. Which do you think the better way, either the Board of four professors or one assessor with a professor? —I look forward to the four colleges being separated with regard to degrees, but until that comes about I would be in favour of the four professors acting together. 15. Without the assessor ?—Yes. 16. Generally speaking, you agree with the pamphlet? —Generally, yes. I was not at first in favour of it, but having thought it out more I now am. 17. Do you think the system of competitive scholarships should be abolished? —Yes. I think all who can reach the prescribed standard should have a scholarship. 18. Irrespective of whether their position is such that their parents can afford to pay?—l do not think a man worth £10,000 a year should be permitted to send his son up for a scholarship. 19. You probably agree with the professors that the gift of these scholarships should be in the hands of the professors, and that they should be given to those who cannot afford to pay for their education? —Those who cannot afford to pay for their education should have the first claim.