1.—13 a.

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[PBOFBSSOB PIOKEN.

Junior Scholarship Examination, and such things to liuve the work carried on properly. Iheru is far too much time given in the schools to cramming in preparing pupils for examinations of that type. 77. Do you think thai with certain prizes as the goal in front of students and teachers you would ever get rid of thai .' I think they could get rid of it to some extent, but I do not know whether it is desirable to gel rid of it absolutely. The important thing is that it should not dominate I be situal ion. 78. In response to a question you said you recognized the necessity of a .system thai connects the University with primary education, with the secondary schools and technical schools, and that you admired their work and recognized their work as of value to the University? — Yes. quite so. 1 recognize the importance of the connection between those various branches of the education system. It seems to me to lie vital. 79. In our technical colleges you are aware of the value of a degree man at the head! — Fes. SO. Now. is it your suggestion that there ought to b" a continuous system of education thai should lead up to the University education altogether? Yes. 81. That is your idea?— Quite. 82. If you had that, do you not think then , is a danger of discounting the advantages? For instance, in technical colleges the students who are going on technical lines might never reach the University!--! do not think it need lead to that. My idea is certainly not that it should lie continuous in the sense that all people should pas> through all stages. My idea of con tinuity is that there should he no overlapping, and that it is possible for each stage to benefit from those before it. 83. 1 was struck by one .statement you made, that the University examinations are not up to date in Xew Zealand. Do you mean to say we are behind the times in New Zealand with regard to them—that is. comparing the external with internal examinations? ■ Yes, with regard to the whole system of our giving degrees we are not up to date. 84. Will you t *-11 us in what respect we are behind the times in that matter I —There is a reference to it in the final report of the London Commissioners in regard to university education. It states. "The University of Xew Zealand, one of the last of the universities to retain this form of examination, adopted under the influence of the old University of London, is at present agitating for reform." 85. That is the opinion of the London University Commissioners on our system here! —Yes. 86. It struck me as a very important statement to make thai the \e« Zealand University was behind the times in regard to tin- examinations they arc conducting lor degrees?—tt is a statement we have made as strongly as we could for some time. 87. Provided that you substituted the internal examinations for the external examinations that we have a! the present time, do you think that would be the panacea for all the trouble.' lam quite certain it is not the panacea for all the trouble. It is one of the absolute essentials. If vim deal with the situation thoroughly that is one of the things that will go with it as a matter of course. 88. Do you think that substituting the internal for external examinations will improve the status of the degree man who gets through! it will improve the training they get. and thai will be found to tell. 89. Simply that the professors at present are forced to act upon lines that they would not act upon if they had Internal examinations? —To some considerable extent that is true, and if they do not act on those lines i lie student is divided between two tilings, which is a most serious problem -the loyalty he wants to give to his teacher, and the work from the totally different point of view of the examination he must meet if he is not to harm his own career. 00. Well, in a lesser degree we had external examinations as compared with internal examinations in our primary schools, and are you aware that there is a very mixed opinion at the present moment as to the advantage that has been gained by doing away with what might be termed the external examination in the primary schools!—l should like to hear on what the opinion is based. I am. not aware of the facts with regard to that to any extent. I should think it is very much a question that many persons identified with the old arrangements have got used to it and cannot adapt themselves to the change. That very much modifies the opinions expressed on those things. There ii the old school and the new school. 91. lias the day arrived that our Professorial Boards in Xew Zealand are composed of such men that the University instruction and examination can be placed in their hands without any outside jackpot? 1 am asking this as a politician who has to provide For the expenditure of the money? —1 am not suggesting that each Professorial Board should conduct its own examination. but that it would be a united system.. My reply to your question is that if the professors are not tit for that class of work they are not lit to be attached to any of the universities in New Zealand, and the sooner they are cleaned out the better, so that others can be put in their places. 92. That is not my question. You are making the suggestion that we should place in the hands of the Professorial Hoards internal examinations for University degrees?—l think, Mr. Chairman, that Mr. Guthrie does not understand my position. We are asking for an inquiry. If you want a personal reply to the question I say Yes. You should give them the right to examine, as you have given them the right Jo teach.