H.—l9b

H. T. J. THACKEE.]

201

82. I want to know if you told Dr. Ferguson and Dr. Harrison of the observations you made as to the condition of the cases? —Yes, I told them. 83. The observations that you have given in your evidence here to-day?— Yes, sir. 84. You told them of what you had seen?— Yes; and that I would do everything I could to help them when I went into the city. I may tell you, too, that Dr. Harrison told me that at that time he had to visit and give medical attention at Mr, Izard's house, Mrs. Bethune's house, Kaiwarra and Berhampore Hospitals, and I believe he also attended the Victoria Hospital. That was all in his day's work. He had to skip in in his motor-car, fly round these five institutions, and visit between three and four hundred men, besides doing his local work at Trentham. There is one thing I omitted to say : that in the last American war in the Philippines and in Cuba, when the men had to be camped on marshy or wet ground they used hammocks in the tents, and had our authorities adopted that suggestion—l made the suggestion to the Minister of Defence in the House, and he made some remark about the men being given the moon. You can take the suggestion that these hammocks should have been used here; they could have been used, and the ladies could have made them quite easily. Then the men would have been able to put their clothes in them, and not on the wet ground. Then, on the Tuesday morning, 29th June, I visited the Victoria Plospital—the top -ward —and it was filled with cases of measles and septicpneumonia cases. Dr. Barclay showed me the charts of the individual cases. There were four serious cases in that ward that day that afterwards died, and he assured me that they were cases of septic pneumonia of both lungs—double septic pneumonia. And, of course, these men in a dying condition were in the same ward as Ihe men'who were convalescent from measles, which was not, a right condition of affairs. That ward was undernursed. In civil life in a private hospital such pneumonia cases would have three nurses during the twenty-four hours; while up there one nurse seemed to be attending to three cases at the same time. 85. Who was in charge?— Dr. Barclay. He was afterwards made Colonel Barclay to make him fit in with the military etiquette of the circumstances. I believe at that time the ordinary honorary staff did not attend to these men. 86. Dr. Martin.] They were responsible all the same?—l believe they understood that they were not wanted to attend to these military patients. 87. Mr. Ferguson.] How do you know? —I was told by one of the visiting doctors. 88. Mr. Gray.] Perhaps Dr. Thacker will say who it was?—No, not unless it is necessary; I do not wish to. There was, I may say, one point of interest, about these two cases, and that was the terrible asphyxiated condition of their bodies generally. It was almost an asphyxiation that would be comparable to that of the soldiers who were asphyxiated by the gas used by the Germans. They were quite purple and blue. 89. The Chairman.] These cases of septic pneumonia in the hospital?— Yes; the doctor was administering oxygen to them. I visited the Berhampore Hospital the same day. I understand that is the infectious-diseases hospital or quarantine hospital. 90. Dr. Martin.] Your charge against the Victoria Hospital is that the septic-pneumonia cases were treated in the, same ward as the measles cases? —Yes. 91. And there was not sufficient, nurses?— That is so. 92. There was no charge against the medical men?—No; they had not the assistance necessary. 93. The Chairmam.] Do you say that the medical staff was responsible because the local staff could not interfere?— These civilian doctors—surgeons and physicians—go on to the hospital staff as honorary visiting men. 94. I quite understand : it was the honorary visiting staff?— The hospital staff was deficient, too; there is no doubt about that, T reckon that that ward could have occupied the full attention of one doctor all the time. The Berhampore Hospital is situated in a gully; I believe, it is called the Berhampore district, You would describe it, as being semi-detached. The different cookinghouses and lavatories were detached from the other part. Approaching it, from the main road you have to go down a steep gravel pathway, with wooden railings. Evidently the place had been very slippery and muddy, for they had sanded and gravelled the path, and there were recently erected steps and bridges over the gully. On the side T went down there had been erected marquees, in which, I was told, with the main building, they had 104 patients when they had a stress of patients. 95. One hundred and four was the maximum number we have had given to us?— The sister in charge, Sister Hanna. gave me these facts. Some of the convalescent, boys—measles' eases— who were sufficiently recovered were doing the fatigue-work—the orderly work. I had a thorough look over the place. The marquees were erected on a steep incline, and I was told by some of the men that when they were asleep they would all roll down to the doorway of the tent. When a man goes to sleep his muscles relax, and in the morning they used to find themselves at the door of the tent, 96. They had floors?— No. To steady themselves and prevent, themselves from rolling down they terraced the floor of the marquees. Now, T investigated the sanitary arrangements—that is, the lavatories. Down in the gully there were two water-closets without any board tops on them. The water was working all right, but they had evidently been recently cleaned out, and only recently come into use. Prior to that the sanitary arrangements were conducted by the nightsoil-men, and they told me that they had to use petrol-tins to store it prior to the men taking it away. The cooking is done in the kitchen, which is at the back of this lavatory, and the water was' brought up from the bottom of the gully. 97. Mr. Fergiison.] Where was the cooking done?— Down the steps in a house there. 98. In the washhouse? —They called it the cookhouse when T was there. 99. Can you pick it out on the plan? —[Witness indicated building on plan.]

26—FT. 19b.