H. A. KNIGHT.]

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221. You told the Committee that Sims, Cooper, and Co. must require a very large amount of capital to carry on their business, but is it quite comprehensible that they can obtain that capital from their own resources or in this country ?—Yes, after they once get a start. 222. Is your company willing to conduct the freezing business only, and not buy? —No, we certainly should not like that. There is great scope for both classes of business. You come down to the common level. Some companies are quite prepared to be fed. 223. Have you had any difficulty about the allocation of space in the ships?— Yes, considerable difficulty. 224. Have you any complaints to make? —We have made our complaints over and ovei again to the Overseas Shipping Committee. 225. Do you know of cases where lamb has been taken when there has been beef and wether mutton?—We do. We have represented those cases, and we got increased space the last time in Canterbury. 226. You think there have been eases where there has been unfairness?—We think so, undoubtedly. 227. You spoke about getting rebates from the shipping companies : do the small shippers who ship on their own account get the advantage of those rebates?— They are not charged any more. They come in under the contract rate —they are under the same basis. 228. Mr, T. A. 11. Field.] You said you were not sure if Mr. Murray cabled from Chicago in regard to the assets of your company. If such a cable came you would know about it?—No, not necessarily; but I cannot conceive that such a cable would be sent. The general manager would be getting a score of cables. 1 cannot see what basis there is for the question. 229. The You do not think any such telegram would have been sent, otherwise you would have known of it? —Yes, in the ordinary course of the business. 230. Mr. Murray was asked this question before the Committee: "When you were in America you had a full inventory of the company's assets cabled to you, did you not?" and he replied, " No, I did not. 1 had certain particulars cabled to me for my own information and for discussion, not with any American people " ?—Yes. 231. He would have a cable of some kind?— Yes. 232. You do not know anything about that cable? —No, but the question strikes me as being peculiar. 233. Evidently there was some cable in regard to your company, because Mr. Murray was asked, "Was it in regard to the assets of your company?" and. he replied, "No, I do not think so." Then lie was asked, " Did you not get, a cable while in America regarding the assets of your company? " and he replied, " No, 1 got a cable regarding the results of the previous year's operations " ? —Yes. 234. Mr. T. A. 11. Field.] Did Sims, Cooper, and Co. have a considerable amount to do with the institution of those works at Imlay? —No, nothing at all. 235. Did they engage any butchers for your company? —The butchers are engaged by the works manager; but if Sims, Cooper, and Co. or any one else sent along a dozen or twenty men when wanted they would be engaged. 236. I. think Mr. Murray said that Sims, Cooper, and Co. engaged some butchers in. Australia for these works at Imlay?—That is very likely. That is nothing to do with the institution of the works. 237. They did not suggest the Wanganui site to you? —No, they did not. 238. You say that the reason why you think the Meat Trust could not get the hold in New Zealand that they have in the Argentine is on account of the number of works scattered throughout New Zealand and their geographical position or distribution? —Partly. 239. We have already seen that a number of small works is a weakness. Through the competition of Sims, Cooper, and Co. one of the works had to shut down, and other small works have been affected. Do you not think that is proof of the fact that the Meat Trust has tried to get control of the meat trade in New Zealand? —I do not. You say it is through Sims, Cooper, and Co. 240. That is only an illustration? —But you say so. 1 have to get that proved to me. It may be the result of good or bad management. 241. You do not think a number of small works would be a weakness in the event of the trust desiring to push their way into New Zealand —they could be forced to the wall easier than a few big works, similar to the position in the Argentine?—No, I do not. 242. Dr. Newman.] What did you mean" when you said that the prices were high in Wanganui because you had your own territory there? —1 do not know that 1 did say that. I said the position was forced. 243. But earlier you spoke of " our own territory "?—Yes. 244. What did you mean by the phase " our own territory "1 —When we decided, for certain reasons, which were chiefly because we were short, of beef and mutton for our operations, we got a map of the whole of the North Island, and saw where the different freezing-works were situated and where they would draw from. There was only one small works at Castlecliff, and there was a big radius of about six million sheep to draw from. 245. But wdiy did that become your territory more than anyone else's territory?— Because we settled down there. 246. But why does that make it your territory—was it, not, anybody else'e territory?— Yes, it was before. 247. Have you done freezing for Armour and Co.?— Yes. 248. And your company is freezing for Armour and Co. this season?— Yes. 249. Have you ever frozen for Swift and Co. ?—Not that I know of.