A. —4b.

Mr. Meredith.'] How much of the Committee's discussion was devoted to Mr. Gurr's and Mr. Smyth's report ? —Very little discussion. Would Mr. Gurr just read it through to you ? —lt was read through, yes. You did not take it away and examine it ? —No. Nor did any other member of the committee I—No.1 —No. But you admitted it as correct ?—Yes. Knowing that it would be distributed to the resident population of Samoa ? —I do not think it was ever intended to be distributed publicly ; it was a report prepared for presentation to the Minister. Was not that report read to the Samoan members of the committee I—lt1 —It was read to them. And explained to them ? —Yes. And you heard it ? —Yes. And they would understand that that was the considered opinion of the European members of the committee ? —The considered opinion of the sub-committee that drew it up. And approved of by the remainder of the committee ? —Yes, excluding the Samoans. As a member of the Legislative Council, you had estimates before you every year ?—Yes. You notice what is said about the Public Works Department expenditure : you remember that ? — Yes. And the cost of salaries in regard to the amount of public works that they had to supervise : you remember that ? —Yes. Where your committee criticized the cost of the Public Works salaries for the small amount of public works that was being effected :do you remember that criticism ? —I cannot recall the particular item. Was there any justification for making such a criticism ? —I must say that I did not go into the figures very carefully. You remember, though, that there was such a criticism ?—I have a recollection of something of that sort. Speaking as a member of the Citizens Committee, was there any justification for that criticism going out 1 The Chairman : The witness has not the remotest idea what was said on this subject, and he has said so. Mr. Meredith.'] You would know, as a member of the Legislative Council, what public works were being undertaken, or in course of operation, would you not ? —lf I have the estimates in front of me I may probably. Would you not have had a copy of the previous year's estimates ? —I would have had a copy, yes. Would you not know the main big works in progress in Apia ? —Yes. And would you not know that they run into a considerably large sum of money ? —Yes. Do you remember what was said in this report about the cost of auditing in Samoa ?—I do not remember that. You did, however, know the cost of auditing ? —I would have known that if I had looked up the estimates. Did you consider the estimates ? —Yes ; but I do not carry all the figures in my head. Do you suggest that you do not know, and have not known, that the cost of your auditing is shown in every annual statement of the estimates ? —Yes. Then, you do know the cost of auditing ?—I must have known ; but I do not remember the figures without looking them up. Did you hear any reference to auditing in that report ? —I do not remember. Were you listening when it was read out ? —Yes. You did not call any attention to that matter ? —No. Is not the £100,000 loan shown in your estimates ?—lt is shown. It is shown at page 24 ? —Yes. You are a member of the Legislative Council, interested in and criticizing the financial affairs of this country :do you know the provisions of section 33 of the Act of 1921 ? —I have not studied that particular subject. What is the effect of the section ?—I cannot say that I know. What is the position in regard to loans under that particular section : I just wish to ask you whether, as a Legislative Councillor, you are familiar with the provisions of that section ? —Reasonably familiar. What is your idea of it with regard to security ? —I must say that I have not gone into the matter very carefully. The Chairman.] Mr. Meredith is asking you as to the general power with respect to the giving of security for loans : you do not know what that power is ?—No. Mr. Meredith.] And you have not made yourself familiar with it since you have been a Legislative Councillor ?—No. And you do not know what that section means ? —No. The Chairman.] When did you join the Legislative Council ? —ln January, 1924. Mr. Meredith.] After January, 1924:, have you asked any question about this matter —that is, about the loans ? —No. So that you have not put yourself in a position to make statements about this loan by making inquiries ?—No ; I must say that I made no particular inquiry. Then, why did you take the responsibility of being a party to the suggestion contained in that report ? —I took it on the statement of Mr. Gurr.

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