THE LOAN PROPOSALS.

Gisborne Times, Volume XXVII, Issue 2674, 2 December 1909, Page 5

THE LOAN PROPOSALS.

AN INTERESTING DISCUSSION.

ALL SCHEMES TO BE SUBMITTED AS ONE.

. At the conclusion of ordinary business at tlast night’s meeting of the Borough Council, Cr. Pettie moved that a special meeting of the Council be held on .Wednesday night at which extraordinary business could be considered. He said his object was to give at least one more opportunity to give members a chance to re-consider the manner in which the loan proposals are to ge before the public.. He was ,hopeful that in some way the Council might discover a common basis and then present a united front in bringing its proposals before the ratepayers. If his proposal were agreed to he would move at the special meeting that beside the present block vote suggested, an alternative proposal should be simultaneously placed upon the voting paper providing for sewerage, electric light, and power, waterworks reservoir, and reticulation. The total of these items would amount with first year’s interest to over £IOO,OOO. He stated that he was satisfied from inquiries he had made that if the proposals were submitted as at present proposed they would he lost. He wished to avoid any waste of time that might thereby result, and urged that his alternative scheme should be given consideration, for he felt sure the most vital proposals singled out by him would be carried by a large majority. Cr. Collins mentioned that he had tabled a notice of motion on this same subject, which he thought should have priority of consideration. Cr. Kirk seconded Cr. Pettie’s motion. . He hoped that after the matters had been fully discussed whatever decision was come to tlie minority would see their way to fall in with the majority. Cr. Clayton supported the motion, and thought it was very desirable that the Council should re-consider the manner in which the loan proposals were to be submitted. The Mayor said there was no objection to having a special meeting, hut considering the matter had gone so far it would be very unwise to make any alteration. .What to do was to educate the people to the wisdom of having all the proposals carried. His Worship stated that without the road; loan the other works would necessitate the payment of special rates. By putting all the loans together a saving of £1750 a year would be effected. So far as he knew the only proposal which met any opposition was that of roads. In that respect he would point out that once the road loan was sanctioned it would be for the Council at the time in office to say how that money was to be spent. It would have to be spent on the particular thoroughfares for which it was allocated, but there was nothing to say how much shingle or how much metal was to be used. Cr. Collins: Do I understand you to say that there is a possibility of Kaitaratahi shingle not being used on the roads ? , The Mayor: Certainly. So much money will be set aside for the different roads; hut the Council will not be tied to any definite method of _ doing the work. Proceeding. His Worship asked the Council to disassociate their minds from tlie question of Kaitaratahi gravel or metal. If there was a better method of spending the road loan money than that which had been suggested the Council would be quite free to adopt it. Detailing the financial aspect, the Mayor stated that the statement presented by the Town Clerk made no allowance for earnings .under the electric light and tramway schemes As a matter of fact the adoption of the electric light scheme would bring about a saving of £I3OO a year, and the tramwavs were likely to show a profit of £isoo a year after paying expenses and sinking fund and interest- on loan. Another strong reason for having all the proposals pooled was that the various works dove-tailed into each other. A point that had been made in opposition was that the loan money expenditure had been distributed over five years. He believed that all the works authorised would be completed in three years. This would mean that the revenue-producing schemes Would come into operation the sooner, and thus the financial position would he still further strengthened. Thus it was that without taking into consideration most favorable aspects it had been shown that for nine Years the rates would be no higher than they were last year. If they looked nine years ahead that was tar enough, for if Gisborne could pay for these works during that period they certainly should be able to do so after its expiration. ... In answer to Cr. Collins, the Mayor stated that the Government would not guarantee a loan of less than £IOO,OO . &e was sorry to note there had been some objection to the Wa-imata bridge on the part of some property owners who had wanted the bridge erected further up the river. • Replying to Cr. Collins, His Worship said there was absolutely no justification for the suggestion made by Mr. Hill that the Kaiti hill was not safe for a reservoir. As a matter ot fact it was perfectly safe. Dr. Bell had seen it. and in due course Ins report would come to baud. They must have the reservoir, as tlie sewerage system was a good deal dependent on it, and with it they could obtain concessions of their insurance rates as had been promised to them. Let the wuole proposals go forward, there was only one point of opposition, which, narro ed down, resolved itself into a question of roads. He hoped to see the Council unanimous in the idea that it was the wisest and most prudent course to put all the proposals together. Cr. Darton. supported Cr. Pettie s motion. He thought it necessary to hold such a meeting, and he still held that they were doing the ratepayers an injustice in putting to them t ie loan proposals as a whole. Even it he was in favor of all the proposals he would vote against them if put as a whole. It was absolutely necessai-y to put the proposals separately, and a special meeting would be most advisable in the light, of being able- to get further information. He could _i.ot . understand the statements of made by the Mayor. If they, doub ed the valuation, it meant double the rate, and according to the Town Cleik s figures, in 17 years Gisborne would require to be half the size of Auckland. During the next 18 .months the majority of the works would be put in hand, and as, during that time, the Council would bo constituted the same he failed to see any value in the Mayor s assurance regarding Kaitaratalu gravel He claimed the right for himseli and for every ratepayer to express their opinions; and their right to have an opportunity of expressing those opinions. He regretted he was. the only Councillor against the Waimat, bridge proposal, but he end not vaim this expenditure justified, nor was th< :site suitable for what had . been th< original- intention. By putting; th< loans separately they would ascerun.

what the public wanted, and then they could amalgamate the loans sanctioned^-I which he believed would amount toj over £IOO,OOO, and ho was quite certain there was nothing, but perhapsj|f one month, and the small amount of/’ cost of the second poll, to be said against the putting ol the proposals separately. Cr. Clayton said that from the Mayor’s utterances it appeared to be futile for them to go on with Cr. Bettie s ' suggestion, lie could not see why the i proposals could not be put separately and consolidated afterwards, it seemed to be a most undemocratic id~« that ~ because a man might he in favor of,':;/ sewerage he was compelled to vote for all other proposals to secure his V’.’sli. The scheme of the Council was prac- - tically immature, and if at a speciil meeting the majority of the Council did change their views, they would begoing to the ratepayers with a misleading conception. He was quite satisfied that the road loan proposals were elide and immature, and he would like to seeall the other proposals carried. There- ' fore he was in a position that he had to vote for something that he was perfectly certain was wrong, in order to obtain what he wanted. He was hot opposed to tramways, but they were a speculation, and he held it would be wiser to ascertain 'if a private firm would be willing to undertake the introduction. The tramway proposals required careful consideration, and be felt that the recreation grounds loan was perhaps a little on the high side, but he was not going to oppose it. He suggested that perhaps there might b 9 some legal objection to the putting of all the proposals together, and he would like to see the borough solicitor asked to give an expression of opinion on this aspect of the question. Cr. Collins said that up till that time no argument had been used to refute the arguments of the “minority inst putting all the proposals before the j ratepayers -at one time. The minority on the Council were not. against the loan proposals, but were distinctly against the amalgamating of them. Ihe j idea of the ratepayers was that they were using drainage as a lever to force p the other loans through. Drainage stood uppermost, and it was going to he lost on account of amalgamation. He was glad the Council should have j: the assurance that there was no hard and fast rule to be followed regarding road construction. This would be an excellent bait if they had any reliance j in the majority, who were content to register a silent vote without being - capable of thinking for themselves. Cr. Kirk rose to a point of order. He asked that the Mayor request Cr. Collins to withdraw the expression about 'Councillors being unable to think. Cr. Collins withdrew the words com- j plained of, and, continuing, said that there was no doubt the proposals, if put in bulk, would be lost, and if the proposals were put separately, he was equally sure that the majority of them would be carried. It would be futile to go any further unless they, there and then, decided to change the manner of putting the proposals before the people. He thought it was a waste of time to endeavor to urge thc-m to alter their course. I? they put the proposals separately, the minority would support i the Council loyally, but if in bulk, they would not support- them, although not opposing them publicly. By putting the proposals in bulk, they were shutting out freedom of thought, which was demanded by tlie democracy they represented. If the loan proposals were lost he would move in a direction, that would clinch the matter of administrartion once and for all. Cr. Smith said that the majority of the Council had decided to put all the proposals together in one loan, and he, for one, saw no Tea son to regret- that 't decision. He had been informed by b: many landed proprietors of the district that they were in favor of the consolidated loan. Also, another point was that if the consolidated poll was lost, they would be able to put- the proposals liefore the ratepayers in another fashion. Cr. Kirk said that no arguments had been raised against the amalgamated loan that- had not been answered. They had had numerous meetings, and healso had been advised by a large.number of ratepayers that it would be most advisable to put the jiroposals together. If they got- the loan of £175,000, they could spend it- in such a manner as to ensure the saving of a large amount of interest. They were there to see that the best- interests of the ratepayers were considered, and if the majority .of the Council, after consideration, decided that the loans should be put en bloc, th'ey should not be doing their duty ii they did not do so. There was no argument against the consolidated loan, and a great deal to be said in favor of itThere need be no rate for nine years, and the different works would all dovetail nicely into each other. In' view j of these facts, it was clearly in the interests of the ratepayers to amalgamate the loans. He appealed to the | minority to sink party feeling, and to, ,’£ believe that the majority,, too, were j actuated- by the best motives. The safest course was to pot all the .proposals together, and for the Councillors: to go unitedlv forth and declare that all the proposals should be carried, Cr. Somervell expressed his appreciation of the Mayor’s statement- regarding the use of Kaitaratalu shingle. Ho again expressed his belief that- it was the best- plan to consolidate the loans. The Mayor said that legal opinion: was that two votes could not- be placed 1 ' on one paper, although several proposals could bo included in one vote. At the last poll great- eonfusiojn had existed when the proposals were putt singly, and numbers of people had voted against- the proposals who had no intention of doing so. He had on two occasions emphatically refused tp consider proposals by private companies for the installation of tramways. He fur-jg ther traversed the statements of previous speakers, and stated that-, although. he originally had been in favor a of putting the loans separately, the | opinions of the leading business people ‘ £ had caused him to change his belief, j and. to urge that the loans be grouped ji together. Let- them leave the issue to j the public, and he would be largely : guided by the opinion of the ratepayers at a proper meeting as to the putting of the loans together or not. He» would, however, require to know- than the arguments against the question were sound and solid. Cr. Harris deprecated any remarks being, made reflecting on the ability of any Councillors to tliink or make up their minds. He personally had a conscience, and always voted in accordance 1 with-it’. Cr. Pettie, in reply, said that the | discussion that had taken place justified him in bringing his idea forward, r as it would tend to more amicable feel- . ings. between Councillors, and possibly , the achievement of what they all desir- A nd, the carrying of the loan proposals. :* With the vopinion of ; the majority the Council as it was, he realised that C there was no good in persisting with liij£: motion, and ho was quite paoo%red td'i , let the matter drop and leave it in iko / , hands of the ratepayers. -v.?& > The discussion then i . the Council rose at 1.40