21

1.—13 a.

W. ( . W. MCDOWELL.]

21. Take chemistry and biology, in which practical work has to be done : why bo against external examination in some subjects if 3'ou are in favour of external examination in the others? The same argument applies in the case of biology and in the case of physics? — l do not think it has the same important bearing. 1 think the need of medical men being thoroughly trained in practical work is of very much more importance. In regard to medicine years ago the Scottish system was adopted in its entirety. 22. You declare that the system is satisfactory : why should you be in favour of one and not the other J In physics, biology, and chemistry, practical work has to be done in every case? — That may be so. The system lias been adopted for years, and it would be impossible to get examiaers in such subjects. 23. Is not that a reflection on the professors.' —1 should not object if one could get qualified outside examiners on all those subjects. 1 received n> day a letter from Professor Chilton, in which he says that in regard to his own subject—biology—it would lie impossible to get an assessor to examine with him in regard to that subject. 24. You said that many abroad approved of our system of external examination! — Yes. 25. Will you give me the names of any well-known educational authorities who have approved of the systeml —1 cannot recollect them, but in the course of travelling in different parts of the world three or four times I Lave met with many educated people who have questioned me with regard to our University examination, and who expressed their appreciation of the New Zealand degree, and stated that that had been enhanced on account of the examinations being conducted by eminent men known all the world over. 26. You cannot give me any authorities for that? — 1 did not say " authorities." 1 was careful to say " many educated people." 27. In the course of your evidence you said that the men whose opinions were given m the appendix to the book on University reform were not familiar with local conditions?—l said the bulk of them. 28. You know Professor Uendy —he has hail local experience ; he was formerly on the staff of the Canterbury College: he is a man who can speak from local experience I—Yes.1 — Yes. 29. He says, "A man who is not tit to examine his students is not tit to be a professor "? — Yes. •'iO. He says, " 1 felt this very strongly when I was myself a professor at Christchurch, and my opinion remains the same now that J am an examiner in England for the New Zealand University. ' 'I hat is a man of local experience, and who carries much weight i —Yes. ■'! I. You know Professor Eliot, President of Harvard University? Of course, he lias not had local experience?—He is an eminent man. 32. He is a man whose opinion ought to be respected? —Yes. 33. Did you read his statement? He says. " American education authorities would generally deny the name of 'university' to a body which was merely an examining body"?—l do not agree with that. 34. Professor Foxuell says external examination "has been the curse of the University of London, and the principal reason for the deplorable condition in which that university now finds itself. "Its constitution is the laughing-stock of foreign professors"? — 1 should like to have the evidence of many others. 35. You know that there is a Commission inquiring into the condition of the University of London, and that it is the third?— Yes, I believe so. 36. Do you know that our University at Dunedin was moulded on the University of London? — Yes. 37. Do you know that those professors have reported on external examinations and have condemned the system .' —I think the} - have in London. 38. llien why in London and not Xew Zealand?— Because the universities are so different. 39. In what respect?—We have four University Colleges. 40. Are you not of opinion that the , professors who teach in the various colleges should meet together and settle on a plan of action ; and if they did that do you not think that a good deal of this interprovincial jealousy would disappear / —Yes. 41. Do you not think it is desirable that those teachers should have a greater voice in fixing the curricula of the University and conducting the examinations?—As regards the curricula, practically it is all done by the professors. That has been my experience. 42. Does that apply with regard to accountancy work?—Xo. I was referring more particularly to the science and arts department. I am not sure regarding the first<syllabus, but the teachers of the subjects were consulted regarding the modified syllabus for the Bachelor of Commerce degree. 43. I want to take you to the professors again. Do you know Professor McCallum and Professor Beattie?—l know Professor Beattie personally. He was in Edinburgh when I was there. 44. He is an old Otago University man?— Yes. 45. He says, " I am strongly of opinion that an examination by a purely external examiner is entirety unsatisfactory "1 — I say it is not an entirely external examination—it is only partially so. 46. When it comes to the critical point of the man getting his official degree, the internal examination has nothing to do with it ? —No, not completely. 17 You said that the men who have given their opinions are not familiar with local conditions. Do JOU know Professor Conn all, of Oxford?—l know him by name. 1 know there are a certain number of good professors who have had experience, and I admit that some of them are acquainted with the local conditions. 48. Do you know Professor Inglis, who has been appointed to the University of Otago? He was Professor of Chemistry at Reading. He says, " I consider an external examination unfair