83

E.—3b

95. I suppose when you go there you see the bill of fare that is in use ?—I have seen it. 96. Do you consider what is put down in that bill of fare a suitable diet for boys in an industrial school?—I think it is sufficient and good. 97. Have you at any time directed that the punishment should be changed at the school ?—I have always discouraged punishment on the body, and recommended when corporal punishment of any kind had to take place that it should be inflicted on the hand. I was never aware that the Manager had given different orders or directions. 98. When you said corporal punishment on the hand, did you specify the instrument?—No; I understood the instrument to be a cane or strap. I have never seen any other used. 99. I would call your attention to sections 46 and 47 of the Industrial Schools Act. Section 46, you will see, refers to Government schools, and seqtion 47 refers to all industrial schools. The difference is that in section 47 the regulations Government may make apply only to the inspection of industrial schools and to dealing with inmates that are not resident. The others apply to a number of things enumerated. Would you be willing, as far as your Order is concerned, that the Stoke Industrial School should be subject to regulations that might be drawn up under some such statutory power as that contained in section 46 ?—I see nothing in it that we could object to. 100. You see no objection to the school being brought under Government regulations for its conduct, management, supervision, inspection, and the employment of the education, diet, clothing, and correction and industrial training of the inmates? —I see no objection. In fact, I was under the impression that there was no double system. 101. Then, if you accepted those, as far as your control of the school extends, of course you would be willing to accept, I presume, all the authority that the Manager receives in order to work those regulations ?—Yes. 102. If the Director did not carry the regulations out, would the Manager have power to remove him ? —I have stated that already. 103. Do you think it would be a good thing to keep a record of all punishments in the school ? —Of all exceptional punishments. 104. What do you mean by exceptional punishment ?—Punishments occur every day, such as for slothfulness and so on. I think it would be a great task to keep a record of those punishments. 105. Would it surprise you to know that in a large number of public schools in the colony of New Zealand that is done ?—I did not know. 106. Mr. Wardell.] Would you consider above three strokes on the hand a punishment that should be recorded ?—I think everything of that kind might be. We have not done it. I think it is quite admissible. I do not see anything unwise about it. I am rather in favour of it, and especially when I hear that it is customary in the colony. 107. Mr. Hogben.] All corporal punishment and all punishment touched upon by these regulations is recorded, and the record is sent every month to the Education Department. Would you see any objection to that being done in the case of Stoke?—l do not. I mentioned simply my appreciation of the thing. But, as I said before, we accept the schools subject to the Government regulations. 108. Mr. Bush.] We understand that you would have no objection to the whole of the regulations being conformed to with the exception of the religious instruction, and there would be no regulation to that effect ?—Yes. 109. Mr. Hogben.] Do you know whether the Brothers did consult with the Manager as regards the punishments that were alleged to have been inflicted —the exceptional punishment in cells?—l am not aware whether they have done so or not. 110. Were you aware of these regulations before to-day ? —I do not remember having read them. I may possibly have read them some years ago, but I have no remembrance of them. 111. Mr. Bush.] One point brought before us was in reference to there being no female in connection with the institution. Is it impossible to have one or more females in connection with the institution ?—lt was found unworkable in the past, or not satisfactory, and it is not customary. 112. But is there a barrier to it ?—We have never done so. 113. Is it an impossibility—is there anything to prevent it ?—Our regulations. 114. Mr. Wardell.] Is it possible from your point of view, that one or two married women, whose husbands might be employed about the premises, should be placed in charge of the clothing, the infirmary, and possibly of the bedding of the institution, and the ordinary cleanliness ? —We would not carry on the institution on those conditions. 115. Mr. Bush.] Is it contrary to the regulations of your Order? —It is. I think the case is fully met by the younger children being detained at the other institution. ■ 116. Then, the employment of women is not permitted by the rules of your Order?— No.

NELSON. Fbiday, 10th August, 1900. George Stanbkidge, examined on oath. 1. Mr. Harleij.] You were in the Stoke Orphanage formerly, and have now been discharged? —Yes; I have now been out two years and eight months. 2. How long were you in the Orphanage ? —About three years.